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Lothian to wheel out pram-friendly bus fleet for city

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Published Date: 18 June 2009
A FLEET of 24 "pram-friendly" buses are set to be introduced on some of the city's busiest routes.
Lothian Buses will be replacing all the buses on the 22 route, which serves Leith Walk and Princes Street, this autumn with the new design, which has space for a pram or buggy as well as a wheelchair.

The company will also be ordering another 26 n
ew buses this year, but has not confirmed how many will feature the new design.

If the trial is successful, around half the buses will have the extra space within the next three years.

The move comes after more than 2,000 people signed a petition criticising the company's decision to impose a ban on non-folding prams to keep wheelchair spaces free.

It was the only firm in Scotland to operate such a ban, claiming it was in line with the Disability Discrimination Act. The company has also been criticised for its ban on mobility scooters, as reported by the Evening News yesterday.

The Scottish Parliament called on Lothian Buses to find a compromise earlier this year and three of Edinburgh's leading disability charities wrote an open letter calling for a solution to be found.

Ian Coupar, marketing manager at Lothian Buses, said the new buses had almost been completed. They will be shipped over from Northern Ireland in the next few months.

He said: "They're being built as we speak. We'll know in the next couple of weeks when the first ones are finished. They'll be coming in this autumn. We've made quite significant changes to the inside, so they need to get certified by the Department of Transport. It's not just as simple as taking the seats out."

The company has not yet decided which other routes to replace the buses on this year. He said it would take into account the popularity of routes in deciding whether to use the new buses.

Some of them, such as airport buses, will be unsuitable for the new design.

Campaigner Catriona Black, 35, from Willowbrae Road, who gave birth to a baby daughter last week, said she was delighted by the news.

She said: "We've been looking forward to this. We're totally confident it will show that there's a great demand out there. There are a lot of new mothers who are totally dependent on buses.

"I think it's a great idea for a trial to concentrate on a certain route. People using those buses can be confident they can get on with their pram.

"It's important to involve disabled people and parents in reviewing this trial."

Lothians MSP Shirley-Anne Somerville, who championed the cause in the Scottish Parliament, also welcomed the news. She said: "It shows Lothian Buses have been listening to the mothers.

"I hope that mums and other carers are encouraged to use the bus. We have an award-winning bus service in Edinburgh that should be available to all."





The full article contains 500 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 18 June 2009 11:19 AM
  • Source: Edinburgh Evening News
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Lothian Buses
 
1

Hmm ...,

18/06/2009 11:40:54
... "Lothian Buses will be replacing all the buses on the 22 route, which serves Leith Walk and Princes Street, this autumn with the new design, which has space for a pram or buggy as well as a wheelchair.

"The company will also be ordering another 26 new buses this year, but has not confirmed how many will feature the new design.

"If the trial is successful, around half the buses will have the extra space within the next three years."

Isn't the 22 route the one that will be replaced by the trams if they are actually introduced?

And aren't they supposed to be operational by 2012 - the very year when "half the buses will have the extra space within the next three years"?

So why introduce them on this route? And aren't there any other routes that could benefit from these enhancements rather than one that is soon to be redundant?

Or does the City Council know something that it doesn't want to share with us? Like that these buses will run out their economic life before the first tram hits the city's streets?
2

Mcewans 80/-,

18/06/2009 11:41:11
When my kids were wee.My wife and myself would fold the buggy down.Is that too much hard work these days?
More money, more taxes, and a fare increase again I suppose.
Bah LRT.
3

Hmm ...,

18/06/2009 11:42:30
... or is Lothian Buses simply demontrating that buses can provide the same facilities much more cheaply that the impossibly expensive trams?
4

Grumpy,

18/06/2009 12:03:54
The buses in use are only a year old - for heavens sake, Lothian Bus would be better puting new buses on the No 15 & 19 routes where the buses are almost as old as First Bus' new ones.
5

the plum,

18/06/2009 12:08:00
more buses of every shape and size and no trams of any description...the council are a league of vandals and theives. SHAME
6

Peter - very disappointed/concerned,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 12:09:55
What a waste of money.

Existing buses are sufficiently provided with room for wheelchairs and buggies (folding ones)/prams with passengers seated in these 'reserved' areas having to move if any of these devices appear on the bus. Political correctness is just going over the top on these kind of matters.
7

arthur conan,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 12:13:11
re no 4 Grumpy. Lothian are currently receiving new vehicles for the 26 route and the remaining will be placed onto other services.But i know what you mean siting on a 19 bus when its not as new.
if this is what Lothian can do without the tram project imagine what could be done if the money was ploughed into the bus company, more new buses and more services. We dont have a bad service in Edinburgh. maybe we wont realise how good it is when its gone.
8

JT,

18/06/2009 12:17:01
Stop pandering to the few that use the buses and look after the fare paying passengers first, Im fed up with the moaners who demand their place on the buses just because they are in a wheelchair or have a oversized buggy especially going to and frm work. Ban them from the rush hour!
9

,

18/06/2009 12:25:24
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
10

Mike Hunt,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 12:30:00
#9 - and I demand a return to dual-door buses.
11

john3,

18/06/2009 12:36:40
I hope the pram friendly buses will protect other passengers from the maniacal wheeling mothers. Yesterday's 26 bore one who, pram laden to the hilt, pulled back and stood hard on my foot(tucked well back under the seat in the disabled space)and strolled off unconcerned as she disembarked in Portobello.
12

the plum,

18/06/2009 12:38:40
edinburgh needs school buses...i am sick to death of horrible teenagers swearing and carrying on each morning...taking up seats and refusing to give them up for the elderly and important. their school bags are too big as the rush up and down the bus hitting good honest ordinary folk with them. they have them strapped to their backs like and barge people and take up twice as much room as everyone else like fat selfish turtles...

...get them off the buses...make them walk.
13

,

18/06/2009 12:51:10
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
14

,

18/06/2009 12:52:04
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
15

jenny,

musselburgh 18/06/2009 12:59:56
This is brilliant news - it is nearly impossible to fold a buggy single handed, particularly if you are wrestling with shopping and the baby (or two!). Some other bus passengers can be very helpful, but not always. It makes all the difference to a young mum to be able to get out using public transport. Hope it gets extended to the 44 bus route.
16

simonp,

18/06/2009 13:10:41
pointless waste of money..let them walk and get rid of the fat quicker
17

simonp,

18/06/2009 13:12:02
#17 let's see who has a sense of humour!!
18

Grumpy,

18/06/2009 13:15:40
(16) - The No 44 bus route has buses only a year old, so what are you on about? Where I am, we only get First Bus - and if you get one 20 years old, it must be a new one.
19

Voice of reason,

EDINBURGH 18/06/2009 13:19:07
The last of the old maroon buses will be gone by the end of July or before , I understand . They have been part of our city's history but nobody seems to care . I have been taking a few photos of them recently .
20

,

18/06/2009 13:27:05
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
21

totally indecent,

18/06/2009 13:34:34
Routemasters is a sweary word.
22

Zoobee,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 13:35:12
I have no objection to prams being on buses - I just hope these people get charged extra for prams that don't fold down so the fares don't go up for the rest of us. They are taking up a space that could be used by fare paying people so I think it's only right they get charged for this new facility.
23

elayne,

18/06/2009 13:37:50
no probs with prams,just the schemie mums who cant control thier kids
24

Hoof Hearted,

18/06/2009 13:39:39
Go placidly amid the noise and haste,
and remember what peace there may be in silence.
As far as possible without surrender
be on good terms with all persons.
Speak your truth quietly and clearly;
and listen to others,
even the dull and the ignorant;
they too have their story.

Avoid loud and aggressive persons,
they are vexations to the spirit.
If you compare yourself with others,
you may become vain and bitter;
for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.
Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.


Keep interested in your own career, however humble;
it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.
Exercise caution in your business affairs;
for the world is full of trickery.
But let this not blind you to what virtue there is;
many persons strive for high ideals;
and everywhere life is full of heroism.


Be yourself.
Especially, do not feign affection.
Neither be cynical about love;
for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment
it is as perennial as the grass.


Take kindly the counsel of the years,
gracefully surrendering the things of youth.
Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune.
But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.
Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.
Beyond a wholesome discipline,
be gentle with yourself.


You are a child of the universe,
no less than the trees and the stars;
you have a right to be here.
And whether or not it is clear to you,
no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.


Therefore be at peace with God,
whatever you conceive Him to be,
and whatever your labors and aspirations,
in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.


With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams,
it is still a beautiful world.
Be cheerful.
Strive to be happy.


25

,

18/06/2009 13:40:33
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
26

Mallory,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 13:45:23
Just watched an elderly frail lady have to 'give up her seat' for a young mother who could easily have folded down her monster buggy. These cosseted mums are a disgrace.
27

gordon aka smoker and proud,

edinburgh 18/06/2009 13:49:38
mums, for years upon years managed quiet well taking 1 or more baby in buses, folding up buggies and carrying messages. then all of a sudden we have the modern mothers! they demand all and give nothing! they seem to think that they have the devine right of way and everyone must give way to them! now we are getting new buses that have a space for a buggie and a space for a wheelchair! ermmmmmmmmmmmm what part of "space" do the numpties that get paid megga bux to run our so called transport system dont they understand? 2 spaces=2 buggies! ban all buggies, ban all kids from buses because they are rude,offensive and inconsiderate, if a mother wants to get on a bus then,as before, fold the damn thing up and carry the sprog! it has to be said! there are bus passes, people work,people use buses to and from work, then you try to get home! bus full of kids abusive and ignorant! women with buggies,pensioners!passes should only be valid from 9.30am till 3.30pm then after 6.30pm, kids at school not allowed on public transport! if they go to private schools then they can afford alternative transport, and pensioners ( yes i will be 1 and i totally agree with free travel) should engage brain and realise that people still work and they should get freedom of a seat and movement in queues! buggies totally banned unless they fold! radical? maybe, but realisic and common sense!(unless your name is foo, then u have a different slant on things)
28

the plum,

18/06/2009 13:51:06
20

what the LAST of the maroon buses??? i feel very strongly about this, very strongly INDEED. i care as i am sure you do. i WILL be, as you are, photographing them at EVERY oppertunity. something MUST be done about this.
29

Mr. Borat Sagdiyev,

Kuzcek, Kazakhstan 18/06/2009 14:04:54
Now here's an idea. Why not replace the trams with... prams?

About as much use and much cheaper too. Wouldn't have to dig up the roads either.
30

roadstohell,

18/06/2009 14:05:47
Thsi doesn't go far enough

Why NOT have buses with priority spaces for carrying Bicycles ????

The trams will have this
31

Angus R,

18/06/2009 14:14:41
i think there should be priority spaces to take your car on a tram so as to save fuel
32

Fluffy,

edinburgh 18/06/2009 14:17:15
PUBLIC transport: vehicles for transporting the public - not bulky equipment!!!!
33

,

18/06/2009 14:34:57
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
34

Mike Hunt,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 15:17:17
Let's have bendy-buses. Take all the seats out in the back half. Plenty room for wheelchairs, scooters and any kind of prams and buggies. Even a stretcher if necessary.
35

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 15:18:38
#33:

If you have a push-bike, why would you want to put it on a LOCAL bus?

Only the other day you were banging on about how you hated ALL motor vehicles so as is the norm for people like you, you are not making sense.

Tell you what, I bet you'd have no problem in accepting a lift from me in my horrible, planet-destroying car if it was a dark, rainy night and you had just ridden into a trm-line on your push-bike rendering it un-ridable, and seeing your plight, I offered to help out with a lift for you and your two kids.
36

sazm,

edinburgh 18/06/2009 15:26:12
I personally managed to fold down my buggy myself to use the bus before i bought my car (although not always easy) & have taken my daughter on a lightweight foldaway buggy but i dont see why disabled should have more rights than a child. Should be first come first served, end of!
Although i dont understand why someone with a big unfoldable buggy tries to take it on a bus anyway, they're not designed for that hence the fact travel systems are available. The council is just wasting more money on new buses instead of just allowing first come first serve.
37

reincarnated,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 15:29:23
Octane Heid,

If he was on his bike, how did he have his two kids with him?
38

pgl,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 15:49:28
to all the people slating mums in particular #8,17 I take it your mothers mistreated you as you grew up other wise you would be less rude and abusive to mothers. I happen to work and use the bus during rush hour and I pay the same fare as everyone else so #8 do you suggest I become unemployed and on benefits so you don't have to put up with me on your bus. I always move for a disabled or elderly person and am more than happy to fold my buggy if there is no space. You both should try travelling with a new born on the buses for the day then you would at least be qualifeid to express an opinion although I personally wouldn't let either of you near my children
39

gordon aka smoker and proud,

edinburgh tramway 18/06/2009 16:09:44
#40 sheeeeshhhhhh never heard of saddle bags????

#41 if your kids have an attitude problem like you i dont think any normal person would want to be near your offsprungs!
40

zebrafied,

18/06/2009 16:15:56
sazm,

It's the law - LB have a responsibility to provide a service to wheelchair users and should not allow other passengers to prevent them doing so. You need to remember the reason Lothian Buses had to start enforcing the rule. It was the behaviour of some parents who choose not to use a folding buggy but also refuse to get off to allow a wheelchair on. They are a sizeable minority unfortunately.

See comments 137-140 under the article below if you want to understand why, beyond the law, wheelchair users HAVE to take priority (disabled parents/children aside)

http://edinburghnews.scotsman.com/lothianbuses/Victory-for-Evening-News-campaign.5101388.jp

I'll also take the opportunity to repeat my suggestion that all spaces should be priority for wheelchair users and available for use by others when they are not required. Otherwise, the situation and rules will only be complicated further, especially as only a few buses will have the facility. I don't want to have to argue with even more parents who think they have an equal right to the space - it's going to turn into the disabled parking argument all over again... It alarms me the number of parents who now think they should be able to park in disabled bays because they look the same as parent and child bays.
41

Foo,

18/06/2009 16:16:43
Why can't everyone just be considerate to each other?

I'm sure most peope are, and most comments aren't really reflections of what people really do.

I bet the lot of you would help a mum fold a pram if she needed help in order that a wheelchair user could get on, or give your seat to someone who needed it.

42

Dragonlord,

18/06/2009 16:30:37
Calm down people. The new buses will have a rope tied to the back, any pram that need it will be tied on in a line.There will be a similar rope for wheelchairs leaving plenty of room for the poor people who can't aford a car.
43

animmo,

18/06/2009 17:39:11
Eventually there'll be no seats left for the rest of us. Buggy users should fold them up, pram users should get buggies. Simple.
44

jenny,

east of edinburgh 18/06/2009 17:44:24
Readers of the Evening News mostly come over as a the most intolerant bunch of bad-tempered folk looking at these comments. Supposing for example you live in the East of Edinburgh and you have a hospital appointment at the ERI or Western, are you asking me to push the baby in a pram all the way there maybe with a toddler tagging along as well. Well, unsurprisingly, I really have no option but to take a bus, but I shall reconsider this if I think I am likely to meet any of you who have made such inconsiderate and unfriendly comments.
45

gordon aka smoker and proud,

edinburgh 18/06/2009 18:22:28
#47 jenny
ok consider this then, you have an appointment at one of the hospitals, you take baby and toddler on bus.
scenario 1: the first 10 buses came that you can take have already got a buggie/pram/wheelchair in the provided space therefor you will not make your appointment time.
scenario 2: you manage to get a bus ok with the aforementioned baby and toddler, get to hospital on time but during your examination you are informed that,
1,you have to undergo a cat scan.
2,you have to be anethisised
3.you have to be admitted.
still going to drag the kids along? or would get a baby sitter maybe be the logical solution therefor freeing up the streets and buses of buggies/prams
46

JT,

18/06/2009 19:14:02
#41For your information, when both my sister and I were in the pram, mum walked everywhere from home into town and upto my grandparents in Craiglockhart and I find your tone about her mistreating us offensive! I have chosen not to have kids, however my best friend has just given birth so I am not totally anti children I just would prefer some mothers to be courteous to the other passengers and fold up their prams and if they cant they should consider getting a buggy that is foldable and not demand the space on the bus. And finally I too give my seat to pensioners and disabled passengers.
47

danbob,

18/06/2009 20:30:52
JT# For somebody to have such a lack of understanding, sympathy and tollerance towards disabled people in your post at 8#. You do get on your high horse when corrected.
48

elayne,

18/06/2009 20:43:44
#44 of course we would,goes without saying!
49

JAMBO 4,

Edinburgh 18/06/2009 22:35:48
I'll say it again "when did you last see a wheelchair and it's occupant on a bus ? - Seldom I bet. Put the poor beggers into a taxi. what else do they do with their disability allowances ? - that's what they are for, not getting on buses - and there will be much more room on the buses for us fit yin's and a' wir bairns and their prams and buggies
50

Hot Mama,

Parkgrove 19/06/2009 09:50:28
JT what makes you think that mums/dads/carers with buggies arent paying to get on the bus? Or getting to or from work?! Stop being so bleedin selfish and accept that it is called PUBLIC transport for a reason! As for people who reckon parents should just fold down their buggy, thats fine if you have a child who can stand but if you have a baby how are you supposed to do that? Hand your baby to a stranger? Heck no! Until you know what its like to struggle to get on with baby, change bag, shopping etc all while people glare at you for daring to use PUBLIC transport you cant really comment cause you dont know what youre talking about!
51

Foo,

19/06/2009 10:01:02
#52

Why exactly shouldn't wheelchair users be allowed on a bus? Your plan seems to consist of 'put them out of the way where we can't see them'

Disability benefit is there to cover living expenses. Clothes, food shopping. NOT so wheelchair users are shoved into taxi's.

Your 'them and us' attitude is typical of the small minded and ignorant. Not a clue have you?

Quite frankly, I'd rather you had to walk so there was more space for wheelchair users on buses, you moron.
52

roadstohell,

19/06/2009 10:07:54
#38 Because it is an "integrated" transport system, you may wish to cycle part of your journey, pop your Bicycle on the Tram, and then pop it off and finish your journey by Bicycle, see simple.........
even may be simple enough for you to understand ?

Green,sustainable, safe & integrated
53

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 11:10:25
#55:

You could ride the length of the tram route in about 15 minutes even if you took it easy. Why would you want to put your bike on th etram and take at least twice the time to do the same journey?
54

pepe the hibee,

19/06/2009 11:13:26
Number 8. There is such a thing as a mum using a bus to get to and from work too. I have to use the bus to get me and my little girl into nursery near my work. I start at 9 and finish at 5, 5 days a week. Should I hang around in the street waiting for rush hour to finish to make sure I dont inconvenience anyone?? Mine does fold but this can be tricky especially when you get the moans and groans (which make you flustered and take longer by the way).
And by law the folding ones are only suitable for children over a certain weight (normally around 6 months) so very young babies do need a larger pram.
55

,

19/06/2009 11:23:31
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
56

Foo,

19/06/2009 11:57:25
58

I'm not sure how you get that. Just because I point out your idiotic attitude to wheelchair users, you assume I am a scrounger?! Then you say, 'get them off the buses'. I'm a higher rate tax payer, so I really do feel I don't scrounge. Do you pay ANY tax?

I'll take some comfort in the fact that judging by your attitude (and your user ID - football following sheep) you're a from the low socio-economic bracket that consists of the poorly educated and obese, prone to cancer, heart and lung problems caused by a combination of poor lifestyle choices and lack of exercise, and as a result, will most likely soon be 6 feet under.

Thank goodness for that.
57

JAMBO 4,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 12:07:59
Foo, that just proved to me that your name should be POO just like the brown stuff you talk. Have a good day and thanks for your higher rate tax contributions , I really will think of you when I am spending it!
58

Foo,

19/06/2009 12:18:10
60

Ah!

So you do admit you're a scrounger. I thought so. Poor education + health problems + poverty = early death for you.

ps. Excellent joke about my name, really witty. Have you thought about a career in comedy rather than the dole and housebreaking?

 

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