Help Sitemap Home Skip Navigation Contact Us Disability Statement

 
 
Saturday, 4th July 2009 Change Date

Premium Article !

Your account has been frozen. For your available options click the below button.

Options

Premium Article !

To read this article in full you must have registered and have a Premium Content Subscription with the Edinburgh Evening News site.

Subscribe

Registered Article !

To read this article in full you must be registered with the site.

Tropical fish shop is left high and dry in tram tide



Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image

Published Date: 14 July 2008
A TROPICAL fish shop owner claims his is the latest business forced to close because of trams roadworks on Leith Walk.
Phil Wanless has closed the Aquatic Rooms, becoming the latest victim of a drop-off in trade due to the ongoing disruption.

His departure comes just a month after the family-run World of Gas closed its doors on Leith Walk after 28 years.

Many other traders on Leith Walk say they are struggling to cope with the roadworks, which have resulted in a massive drop in footfall, as well as a lack of parking.

Mr Wanless, 43, a father-of-two from Portobello, spent the weekend packing up fish, terrapins and equipment at his shop. He said sales had fallen by 50 per cent since the beginning of the tram works, and he could not afford to continue running at a loss.

He said: "It's a heart-rending decision, but I can't continue putting my family's livelihood in jeopardy. All the staff were in tears. It's taken eight years of hard work to get where we are now. I'm a businessman and I understand these decisions have to be made.

"If anything I should have done this three months ago. I only stayed because of my love of the shop and my hope that things would change.

"I think Edinburgh City Council have made some absolutely atrocious decisions. I don't think trams are a priority. Everybody is struggling here. There are a lot of shops that are running at a loss. At the moment Leith Walk is the worst it's ever been."

The Aquatic Rooms employed two full-time and six part-time staff. Mr Wanless has opened a new shop in Tranent, and most of the staff will be moving with him.

He said: "We used to have customers coming from all over Scotland. But if you can't get parked, how are you going to lift a fish tank half way up the Walk?

"I've thoroughly enjoyed being part of this community. But there's a general view not to go anywhere near Leith Walk at the moment.

"Leith always used to be an area for tropical fish shops. I remember going to them when I was a child. Now Leith Walk is just going to turn into a street of convenience stores, bars and restaurants."

Shop assistant Cliff Norman, who lives in nearby Lorne Street, said: "It's a complete disgrace. There'll never be anything like this in Edinburgh again.

"We had a dedicated crew of staff and I've been working six days a week trying to keep the thing going. There's always been an aquarium in Leith for the past 40 years. This is the last one."

Gordon Burgess, chairman of the Leith Walk & Constitution Street Traders Association, said the Aquatic Rooms was the fourth shop to close since the tram works began.

He said: "It's horrendous. Without a shadow of a doubt, all businesses are suffering.

"We're all open for business, but even if you can get there, you might assume many places were closed. It's like wacky races driving down Leith Walk at the moment, and any parking that becomes available is often taken by works vehicles.

"We've had no respite for a year. The compensation that shops have been given is only a drop in the ocean."

No-one was available from tram firm TIE to comment, but they have previously said that there could be a number of factors involved in a business closing.


The full article contains 592 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Grumpy,

14/07/2008 12:05:05
And still the sign on London Road at Piershill says "All shops open for business during tram works". They should change the first three words to "Many shops closed...."
2

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 12:11:23
#1 Or, to be more accurate, they should change it to "4 shops out of more than 200 along the trams route have closed since work began. All showed signs of weak trading before the tram works started."
3

I love to eat Sellotape,

14/07/2008 12:13:22
No. Just ... no.
4

Optimus Prime,

Cybertron 14/07/2008 12:14:26
Something tells me the credit crunch and peoples inability to purchase luxury goods such as tropical fish is the real reason.

Tropical fish hardly fits into the passing trade category.
5

SDRAWKCAB,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 12:15:42
I bet cash convertors doesn't close!
there will always be a large supply of junkies trying to punt their stolen goods.

Leith walk is a hole anyway!
6

Richard Head,

14/07/2008 12:16:23
Mr Wanless seems to be rather selfish.
Why should the tram construction be halted just for him?
Free ad for his shop in Tranent though.
7

FrankGallagher,

14/07/2008 12:18:34
the trams are ruining this plaice
8

FrankGallagher,

14/07/2008 12:20:07
from the picture it looks like he should be working for Rock Steady or perhaps he could take his fish onto Ready Steady Cook, kill two birds with one stone
9

eric,

14/07/2008 12:23:18
oops
10

,

14/07/2008 12:29:41
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
11

Bonzo,

14/07/2008 12:42:13
#14 Why not take up the lease yourself?
12

Beergut,

Embra 14/07/2008 12:43:04
I used to be a regular but the roadworks there have been horrific for about a year now and I haven't gone near the place. At one time you couldn't even cross the road there. It is hardly surprising people like me and many others by the sound of it have gone elsewhere where there is somewhere to park.
13

Curious Yellow,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 12:46:20
You jokers are just so pleased with yourselves, aren't you? Mr Wanless hit the nail on the head. Never mind how close the shop was to Princes Street - how do you carry a large fish tank to wherever you have managed to get parked? Bear in mind - that might be at one of the ever so helpful Park and Rides on the outskirts. I concede that some shopkeepers might be using the tram works as an excuse for closing a business which may already have been on the weak side, but Mr Wanless appears to have tried to soldier on in the forlorn hopes that things might improve. And remember - this is only the FIRST PHASE OF THE D*MNED TRAM WORKS! Once this is over, they'll then start digging it all up again to lay the lines.
14

Martin 2,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 12:56:34
Leith Walk is a complete mess at the moment -even the Bus Drivers don't seem to know where the temporary bus stops are ! Moving the bus stops also means having to stand in the rain as there are no shelters at the "temporary" ones -i.e. with an opening date of July 2011 means temporary is only for 3 years!

I would love TIE to publish how much longer the road will be in its current state.
15

PG,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 12:57:58
This used to be a great wee shop. Helpful staff with a friendly atmosphere. Kids and I used to love going in for a look around and some advice. But when the tram works started making it difficult to get anywhere near the shop let alone get parked, we stopped going in. We tried elsewhere when we've needed stuff, but there isn't really another fish shop of it's calibar in the city and I assumed because it is a specialist shop relied upon by hobbyists that it would be safe. How upset (and guilty) am I now! Trannent is a bit far to go for a few fish and plants - makes it an expensive hobby. Ironically, my tanks are looking a bit rubbish after 9 months of less regular plant additions and I was thinking of going in.
16

I love to eat Sellotape,

14/07/2008 13:04:55
Oh my Cod, here they come. Fish puns. Mario's proving a Dab hand at them, although he likes to Skate on thin ice.
17

Brian the Barbarian.,

Leith walk ( The closed bit ) 14/07/2008 13:09:14

Topical fish taste carp anyway. Much batter with a deep fried mars bar.
18

Brian the Barbarian.,

14/07/2008 13:11:06
PG 19#

Your comments are truly ironic.
Makes ya think no ?
19

Leila,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 13:16:34
#3 "...4 shops out of more than 200 along the trams route have closed since work began. All showed signs of weak trading before the tram works started."

You know that for a fact, do you, Duncan? Have you seen all their accounts?
20

I love to eat Sellotape,

14/07/2008 13:17:39
I keep tropical fish
I keep tropical fish
21

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 13:26:21
#25 I did choose my words carefully. There are more signs of weak trading than are contained in a company's accounts. The mobile phone shop that closed, for example, had a "Cellnet" sign outside and advertised an 031 telephone number. The "World of Gas" had been in decline for years because of the price differential and far greater convenience of out-of-town large multiples. And, as the article states, the Aquatic Rooms was the last remaining aquarium shop in Leith - fifteen years ago there were at least five. Fashions change, and an aquatic shop will always be at risk of that. Like pubs blaming closure on the smoking ban, shops blaming closure on the trams are simply looking to a convenient scapegoat.
22

Dr Egg,

I can't wait! 14/07/2008 13:28:57
I think the trams will be lovely and the ruined livelihoods will be worth it. Think of the colourful livery... better than any living fish.
23

Billy Effluvia,

Drumnadrochit 14/07/2008 13:32:15
could they not develop tropical fish powered trams
24

I love to eat Sellotape,

14/07/2008 13:52:14
Nemo ain't in Tranent.

He's here, with me, right now.
25

Andrew Kent,

EDINBURGH 14/07/2008 13:55:05
I used to shop at the Aquatic Rooms quite regularly but the last time I attempted to go I could not find anywhere obvious to park and so I started going to the shop in London Road instead. I actually feel quite bad to hear they are having to close, the Aquatic Rooms was a decent business and I am certain that it would still be going strong if it was not for the hated tram project.
26

JML,

14/07/2008 13:58:45
With friends like TIE and the cooncil, who needs anemones?
(sorry.............)
27

Gorgie_Tony,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 14:01:43
#33 - another example of the lazy car driver - he can't park right outside the shop, so goes to another shop. Instead try parking elsewhere and walk to the shop - like the rest of us do.
28

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 14:05:32
#33 Just out of interest, where on London Road do you park? That shop is on a bus lane isn't it?
29

tommysheridanistheman,

edinburgh 14/07/2008 14:09:56
@7
yawn, u really are an idiot, lets see what intelligent comments u come up with when the shop owners of shandwick place, haymarket and all points west start moaning about the impact on their businesses as this farce makes its way westwards.
30

I love to eat Sellotape,

14/07/2008 14:10:03
One website lists these as the ten most popular tropical fish:

1.Angelfish (bicolor)
2.Blennies
3.Butterfly fish
4.Cardinal fish
5.Clownfish (Nemo)
6.Damselfish
7.Goby
8.Dragonets
9.Saltwater eels
10.Dotty backs

My grandfather went out with a girl named Dotty Becks.
31

PG,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 14:14:11
Brian

I am more a "potterer" than a serious hobbyist. The stuff I buy can be bought anywhere including online (apart from maybe the fish). The AR has a marine fish section second to none in the city and that stuff isn't as easy to get elsewhere. Some Saturdays you could be behind someone spending upwards of £100 just on fish and that's why I wrongly assumed it would ride out the storm. Other business on LW are available everywhere, but there are only a handful of aquatic specialists in Edinburgh and most of them nowhere near as good. So I'm wondering where the really serious hobbyists went. This was not a business on the edge, it was thriving. As I said in my post, I do feel guilty now for going elsewhere because of the inconvenience and now I'm left with the permanent inconvenience of having to travel to Trannent for decent fish. So yes it does make me think and should make others think too. We take these places for granted and then suddenly, it's too late and they're gone. Edinburgh will end up losing all it's diversity and character and we'll be left with bland supermarkets and large corporate owned shops joined by the tramlines.
32

Bertie The Bat,

14/07/2008 14:29:17
£2-25 a pint.
33

Angus Mcdonald,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 14:29:49
It is all too easy to blame the trasm on the downturn of business. Aquatic rooms' website was never updated and it is cheaply done. All the staff apart from two are all rude as anything and they employ a little kid to harass people to buy stuff. No wonder they have to close down-bad business practice is the most likely reason as to why they have to close.
34

Andrew Kent,

EDINBURGH 14/07/2008 14:33:00
#35 - Taking live animals on a bus if far from ideal, and I'd rather get them home quickly so that they don't die.

#36 - The shop is on Lower London Road so I don't need to park in a bus lane.
35

Jasbar,

14/07/2008 14:36:03
Buying tanks, gravel, fish etc. The last you need is a hike to where your transport is.

Mr Wanless perhaps made only one mistake. He seems to have somehow believed that this SNP led council actually cares. They don't.

And they are unaccountable. They are a law unto themselves. The unelected officials have a vision of the Edinburgh they want to create and they are doing it. We don't register.

And the hapless councillors are manipulated through the process, forced to accede to officials' demands, because they value their position higher than their principal.

That's why they can take away a man's livelihood just before a Christmas where his kids have to go without. They do because the can. And no one cares because they don't believe it will ever happen to them.

And if we disagree with councils' deviousness? Then we have to wait up to four years in the hope that any new incumbents will include the issue in their basket of policies. But we have to accept the whole lot or stuff us.

So the objections to the trams will be buried at the bottom of everything else. That's why there is nary a councillor who attracted any more than one in six of his/her electorate to vote for THEM. Some democracy we live in, eh?

It's not about a vision for the future. It's about control.

It's not about reason and logic. It's about seeking advantage.

It's not about fair play and concern for the individual. It's about a ram job so council officials' egos are massaged.

When they're enjoying the many benefits, free lunches and glitzy events, do you think they will ponder for even a nanosecond those who have been financially and otherwise damaged by their draconian, fascist control of our city?
36

Franck,

14/07/2008 14:41:30
Face It Leith Walk is the Plaice to be.

Sorry i am being shellfish, or is that selfish.
37

Statsman,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 15:01:55
Edinburgh RIP.
38

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 15:08:49
#46 Oh take your hyperbole and stick it. The trams work was always going to be painful, but it is being undertaken because it will benefit the city in the long run. The same scale of objections were raised at the building of the North Bridge, and at the destruction of the Lawnmarket closes when George IV Bridge was constructed. All change will be opposed by some; the council's job is to act in the best interests of the city as a whole.
39

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 15:16:15
#51 Happy Bastille Day Mario. We're standing up and singing the Marseillaise every half an hour in our office as a tribute to the day they released a rapist and a couple of thieves from an almost empty prison. You got any celebrations planned?
40

Statsman,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 15:29:56
49 Duncan in Edinburgh

The council seems to act only in the interests of the council. It is meant to represent the taxpayers that pay their wages.

If you want to defend the undemocratic ruination of businesses because of council arrogance. Fine. Just don't expect people to agree with you.

Furthermore, are you trying to claim the trading conditions of the 1700s and 1800s are identical to today? Were you alive then? Are you just making stuff up in a mad scramble to justify trams?

Don't answer. Those were rhetorical questions. You are either completely deluded or being paid to spout this nonsense.
41

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 15:41:11
#53 And breathe.

No, I'm not defending anything undemocratic - the trams scheme was voted on by both the current and previous City of Edinburgh Councils, and by both the current and previous Scottish Parliaments, and on all four votes our elected representatives backed the plans. This is democracy in action. Democracy does not mean pleasing all of the people all of the time, and it certainly does not mean pandering to whichever group shouts the loudest.

No, I never mentioned the trading conditions of the 1700s and 1800s. My point was simply that the building of the North Bridge and the building of George IV Bridge both had to be forced through under howls of protest, but stand today as essential parts of what we consider the heritage of Edinburgh to be.

All change is painful. The trams will be a net positive for the city. Stop moaning and get with the programme.
42

Statsman,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 15:49:02
56 Duncan in Edinburgh

Can you show me the referendum where we got to vote on trams?
43

ValdasTheMan,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 15:56:46
Will Thomas get his own branch line?
44

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 16:01:39
#58 Is that your convenient redefinition of democracy - "there's something I don't agree with, give me a referendum on it"?

As a matter of fact we *did* have a referendum on the whole local transport approach in Edinburgh, and like idiots we voted for minimal investment and the freedom to drive our cars (at 1mph) through the city every rush hour. If we had voted for a congestion charging scheme we would have had three tram lines by now, vastly better funded buses linking to them, and we wouldn't have started paying the congestion charges until the improvements were up and running.
45

Statsman,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 16:07:43
61 Duncan in Edinburgh

I would also like a referendum on whether council tax money should be spent on employing council PR staff to post on here.
46

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 16:11:00
#62 Good for you. I usually find when a discussion reaches the point that one side is accusing the other of being part of a conspiracy, it's time to end it. For what it's worth, and for the hundredth time, no, I do not work for the council. I didn't even vote for either of the parties currently ruining the city.
47

ValdasTheMan,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 16:15:30
#62, #63 Given the amount of time you have spent posting on this thread, you both must work in the public sector!
48

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 16:21:34
Edinburgh's marvelllous tram system will bring economic regeneration as businesses swim in like shoals of neon tetra fish.

However if the shop that sells wee motorbikes goes out of business I will be sendinga stern letter to the Lord Provost, or some similar figure of powerful authority.
49

mystic,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 16:32:30
#14 Do you have something against the Asian community like?
50

Statsman,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 17:10:11
64 ValdasTheMan

Certainly not.
51

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 17:17:24
#68 So the accusation is outrageous to you, but your accusation to me was somehow reasonable?
52

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 17:19:46
# 69 - The pubic sector in Edinburgh is fast expanding. A tram proof business it is too.
53

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 17:20:35
#70 how do you get 2 whales in a mini?
54

Statsman,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 17:35:41
69 Duncan in Edinburgh

What accusation was that?
55

GMann,

Leith 14/07/2008 17:39:14
#7 SDRAWKCAB You say Leith walk is a hole - I assume you were just passing through.
56

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 17:39:53
#74

From #53 "You are either completely deluded or being paid to spout this nonsense."

From #62 "I would also like a referendum on whether council tax money should be spent on employing council PR staff to post on here."

That accusation.
57

Statsman,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 17:51:39
76 Duncan in Edinburgh

Is this your way of saying that you're completely deluded?
58

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 18:02:53
#73 'how do you know when you have four elephants in your fridge?

dunno that one - but I do know that the trams are a white elephant, outdated technology. By the time the trams are finished, forward-looking cities will have GPS navigated driverless buses that run on human effluvia.

Funny how nobody talks about the ozone layer any more. Did it just heal up and now it's the ozone scab?

By the way - trams. Don't do it. There's a link between trams and disease. Just look at the figures - last time central Scotland had trams, 90% of children had scurvy and/ or rickets, halitosis was almost universal, and the average lifespan was 46, and dandruff was also endemic.

Coincidence? Hardly...
59

Jed Smith,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 18:07:49
Although having said all that, I don't believe Cliff Norman's drop in business was entirely down to tramlines.

I think it's far more likely that Cliff's sales were down because he didn't diversify.

He only sold tropical fish, right? If he'd maybe also sold:

tropical chips
tropical deep fried pizza
tropical chicken
tropical irn bru in a glass bottle
tropical 10 Regal King size

etc., then he might have stood a tropical chance.
60

GMann,

Leith 14/07/2008 18:14:23
#56 Duncan from Edinburgh "All change is painful. The trams will be a net positive for the city. Stop moaning and get with the programme." Not very democratic decrying someone's right to moan. I really don't care one way or another about the trams I am just fed up living in a town that could be twinned with Beirut. I assume we are doing all the pain for you to gain.
61

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 18:17:39
#82 - could be, although I hear they're reintroducing the Routemaster elephant from a small breeding colony at Regent's Park zoo.

I think Edinburgh should have a transport re-think though.

Cars, buses, taxis, aeroplanes, space shuttles = GOOD

Trams, bicycles, pushchairs, rickshaws = BAD
62

Douglas,

Bathgate 14/07/2008 18:29:55

how do you know when you have 4 elephants in your fridge???

You can't get the door shut.

#26 Sellotape: Mine's a mild and bitter.
63

Gonnaenodaethat,

edinburgh 14/07/2008 18:33:50
Went to the shops yesterday and seen it was closed. The best fish shop thats been in Edinburgh for years and years. I'll miss Sky :). The advice is the worst thing to lose. Damn these trams. I suppose it'll have to be Tranent.

Good Luck Phil.
64

Duncan in Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 18:36:15
#83 As it happens I won't gain at all from the first tram line. But I am confident that as Edinburgh realises what a boon the trams are, we will be able to fund tram lines 2 and 3 and achieve the integrated public transport system that our city deserves.

Since you live in Leith, it is *you* who will be gaining from this round.
65

PG,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 18:41:32
Can't believe you idiots talking this way about people losing their livlihood!

For the record, I always found the staff helpful and polite. Which is more than I can say for some of you. It's not a joke to build up a successful business over 8 years only to have it wiped out for a tram system nobody wants! It won't be the last business to close due to it either. It's about time the EN forums banned such idiotic "comment".


66

Jed Smith,

14/07/2008 18:45:18
#86, #26
"he's an Avon representative"

#85 Jakarta? "Naw she was in a rickshaw".

Just remembered another thing cliff could have sold: Lilt, for the totally tropical taste.

Trams are 'smart' backwards. Coincidence? hardly...

67

The Judge,

14/07/2008 18:45:19
#83 You say you're looking forward to tramlines 2 & 3.

The city council can't afford them(they can't even afford this one), the government have no plans to fund them and private enterprise isn't interested. So unless you've found a money tree please tell us where the money is coming from.
68

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 18:46:00
#89

PG - thanks for the tips
69

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 18:47:17
#89 - idiotic comment?

That's a bit rich, coming from a chimp!
70

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 18:53:21
Tam Trams are just jobs fir they boys and the lasting legacy of a Labour party so obsessed with squandering that they totally ignored their public.

It does not matter to them how many wee men they crush as long as it's no their wee men!) along the way so long as the gravy tram keeps the cash rolling in so the council and their favoured contractors can gorge themselves senseless on this, another, white elephant project that will deliver negative service for the people at a vastly inflated price.

Looks like we can look forward to council tax hitting £5000 in the next ten years !! What Labour has done to this country in the last ten years is beyond a simple betrayal of the people it is systematic tax and squander racket designed to suck working people dry to serve a selfish and corrupt government.

We will look back on these times with a sense of shame that we were the generation that allowed these sickening Labour poisoned dwarves fritter away the freedom of decent folks and open the doors of GB inc to all and sundry who want to come and live here without thinking about the people who already live here. Britain as we know it has been ravished by do-gooder legislation and PC culture- but the people who really destroyed Britain are those who witnessed the court martial and subsequent execution of common sense ... and said and did nothing!
71

GraemeH,

Edinburgh 14/07/2008 19:29:35
#88 - Duncan, you said earlier that the tram will be a net benefit for the city, yet the business plan shows it expects to generate less net income than doing nothing (read it if you doubt me). £700m spent to end up in a worse financial position than doing nothing at all. Does that sound sensible to you?

Oh, and for the record the current tram scheme was NOT voted on by the Scottish Parliament. Tram lines 1 and 2 were approved, but when TIE worked out they could not build them within the approved budget they decided to proceed with the current single line plan.
72

James Collins,

Leith 14/07/2008 20:37:21
Duncan from Edinburgh,

purely as a query, why do you think the trams will benefit Edinburgh in a way that he bus services didn't?

Not having a go. Honestly interested if there are any plus points to this.
73

Sports for Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 21:13:41
I know I may get shot down for saying this... but... Leith Walk isnt that bad. I drive up and down it for work multiple times a day - and the only place I have an issue is at the round-a-bout at London Road (and that's because of divers stupidity - but I wont go into that). I have parked MANY TIMES on the walk and used the shops. In my opinion, the main thing keeping punters away is 'everybody' stating that Leith Walk is closed and that all the shops are struggling because of the tram works. It is amazing what a little bit of positivity can do - look at Haymarket/ Dalry area... no issues there, and - in a way - much more restricted access.

I think its time that people start looking on the positive side of things. I hate the fact that edinburgh is becoming such a negative city.
74

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 21:27:38
#97 - divers' stupidity eh? The nearest body of water is a mile away. They really must be stupid. If I see anyone with an aqualung and a wetsuit outside Vilny Villians, I'll apprise them of your entirely reasonable concerns
75

Sports for Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 21:28:32
#96 The plus points I consider key to trams include:
- Higher capacity (and if you use the 22 – this will be awesome)
- Busses are causing congestion. Yes, its a great service, but if you have to do business in the city, a few less busses on the road will be great.
- Edinburgh is full! We do need to sort out transport. You could barely fit another bus on Leith walk or princes street. The trams provide an alternative.
- I use to run before work thru the gardens and along to Dalry. I had to stop due to the fumes... from busses. No fumes with trams. No fumes = healthier people and cleanter streets and buildings.
- For my grandparents – the trams (we have used these in Spain) offer unparalleled access
- Great for business commuters (quick and regular)
- The construction work for the trams, will ensure employment for a substantial number of people through a financially difficult time.
- The movement of utilities is identifying ‘problem points’ of an aging infrastructure – the repairs being done will reduce future problems.
- Road surfacing, traffic management and rights-of-way are being addressed (at last). If they do a good job, this will be advantageous for the future

Yes – I am 100% for trams. I do, however acknowledge that the true overall success or failure will be realised in 2011. It’s happening, funding is in place, it won’t stop... let’s be optimistic, and not pessimistic!
76

Sports for Edinburgh,

14/07/2008 21:29:26
#98 - :)
77

Ian down under,

Kawerau 14/07/2008 21:35:35
There was an earthquake in Alaska yesterday. Rumour has it the trams were to blame. My coffee was cold this morning.. trams too. Scotland got cheated by Italy in the Euro2008 qualifying.......we all know why now, don't we?
To listen to the antitrammers you'd think they were a joint creation of Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot and Mao all designed to suppress the people. Sorry folks they are simply a chance to START improving the local transport system. They are not ideal but that is because there is not enough money to do the ideal thing which is UNDERGROUND IN THE CITY CENTRE because there is so much money spent on roads that what public transport gets is a pittance in comparison. The motorway was supposed to be the answer to everything. If you want to keep that belief don't go to Birmingham because you'll see it did not work. They are reopening and improving rail lines and horrorrrrr they also built a tram line [very popular too and being extended].
78

Ian down under,

Kawerau 14/07/2008 21:38:21
Sorry about the fish tank shop but did you know you can buy all sorts of fish tank stuff over the internet. The only things you really need a shop for are the fish themselves and they usually come in a wee bag of water.
79

Jasbar,

14/07/2008 21:46:46
"#46 Oh take your hyperbole and stick it. The trams work was always going to be painful, but it is being undertaken because it will benefit the city in the long run. The same scale of objections were raised at the building of the North Bridge, and at the destruction of the Lawnmarket closes when George IV Bridge was constructed. All change will be opposed by some; the council's job is to act in the best interests of the city as a whole."

Benefit the city in the long run? Duncs you mustr be stupid, devious or both. I've already asked what your link to our fascist council is. Yet you seem somehow reluctant to tell us honestly.

Even you must know that it will only benefit those who are not going to be paying for it.

And if you believe this council is acting on behalf of the good burghers of Edinburgh, I wonder how many of us would have taken away a man's livelihood just before Christmas, yet they allowed a criminal to keep his restaurant licence. You think this fair?

That's fascism Duncan.

I would just like to know who got the brown envelopes for stiffing the Edinburgh public into financing trams. Do you know Duncan? Go on tell us. Did you get one? How much was in it?

Then tell us the real reason, which we all know, why we weren't allowed a referendum?

Then tell us how the council control freaks are doing a good job representing us?

Here's laughing at you simpleton.
80

Ian down under,

Kawerau 14/07/2008 21:53:11
Apparently there were objectors to the building of The Forth Bridge, Sydney Harbour Bridge, the Taj Mahal, Edinburgh Castle, the Empire State Building and the Eiffel Tower. They were right of course and they were proved to be failures and blots on the landscape.
There were objectors when the French built the first TGV line...they were right too, were they? Did they build any more TGV lines after the first one?
People objected to the Boeing 747 and of course they were right too, it was a failure that nobody wanted...wasn't it?
The QE2 was a mistake.
Discovery of penicillin frightned a few probacterial sympathisers.
Funny how the word Luddites keeps coming to mind
81

Maxibus,

14/07/2008 22:06:56
SURVEY SAYS NET PASSENGERS ARE SATISFIED AND WANT MORE
Nottingham Express Transit – Sunday 6th July 2008

A comprehensive study has been undertaken for the fourth year running amongst NET passengers to gauge customer satisfaction, awareness and usage of the tram system. The results of this survey show a major improvement from 2006 on the satisfaction on the overall journey/on board rating and the tram stop and website rating. Overall 93% of those questioned were satisfied.

The overall journey satisfaction and on board rating rose 16% in 2007 with 75% saying they were satisfied whilst a 17% rise was found on the tram stop and website rating, with this also being at 75%.

When questioned about extensions to NET, respondents were also positive in their replies. 60% said they were aware of where the new routes were being planned and 81% saying they thought it would be good if NET was extended. Reasons given included ease of use and convenience, congestion and the reduction of cars on the roads and other environmental and wider benefits to be enjoyed in the city.

Cllr Jane Urquhat, Portfolio Holder for Transport and Area Working at Nottingham City Council, said: “We are delighted with these research results, which indicate substantial improvements, with passengers reporting high levels of satisfaction across all areas. This is reflected in the increased passenger numbers, which have seen a 2.3% growth in 2007. The obvious and continued success of Line One confirms that the plans to expand the network to provide tram services to other areas in Greater Nottingham are valid and that there is widespread support for these developments.”

Finally, 98% of those questioned said they would recommend NET to friends and family.

* A full list of the survey results can be found on the NET website

Source: Nottingham Express Transit
82

Ian down under,

Kawerau 14/07/2008 22:14:35
# 105 You wash your mouth out with soap. How dare you write this thing. Don't you know the trams are the work of the devil himself. I know this I heard a bloke on a box at the Mound last Sunday telling me. Seemed a reasonable chap.........got taken away in a wee van though.
83

dory,

14/07/2008 22:29:24
Trams 512 million pounds is this good use of our money, rite now, doesnt edinburgh have more important needs rite now ????? (health, education, etc).
84

Ian down under,

Kawerau 14/07/2008 22:37:45
#108. Transport is probably the most important modern society need, after decent defence. There is no point in having decent health and education if you can't get to it. Modern healthcare is expensive and complex and needs some centralisation to be affordable so transport comes to the rescue. The same applies to schools and other educational establishments.
Just look at Queen Margaret College, they've centred on one site but has fairly easy access with a station at the door.
85

Jed Smith,

Moscow 14/07/2008 22:38:43
#104 - there were people who also protested against:

Enric Miralles' scottish parliament building
John Major's 'Cone Hotline'
The Darien venture.
Knocking down decent city accommodation to build the ugly Edinburgh University towers.
Building a motorway thru the centre of Glasgow
The Vietnam war
The Sinclair C5
Betamax video
The millennium dome

etc
86

Plantagenet,

14/07/2008 22:45:09
I have noticed for the first time on these tram threads that phase 2 and 3 have been mentioned? one of my main criticisms of the trams was 'what's the point of only one line running east to west, what's that going to solve? what about north to south of the city or a circular route, is this in the future plans? If so, then I can grudgingly see a future for trams in Edinburgh, if not, well.........
87

dory,

edinburgh 14/07/2008 22:52:43
Ian, i fully understand ur point regarding transoprt i dont believe that trams and all their costs r the answer, and im to be convinced that what we have not now got a decent transport system in edinburgh, comparatively
88

Julian.,

edinburgh 14/07/2008 23:03:51
#110 Jed smith,

Nice retort. Of course at the end of the day this is all just idle banter. The fact is this tram line will be built. What people should be concentrating on is holding TIE and the Council to account for any bad management/waste of money.

Maybe someone (possibly the EEN) could sit down and work out how much these traders are losing as a result of the tram line, and how much is down to the normal business cycle.

Of course it's much easier for the EEN to highlight a couple of individual case like this one and pretend that gives us all the answers.
89

Julian.,

edinburgh 14/07/2008 23:08:01
#111 Plantaganet,

Give it time. Despite what all these doomongers say about it being a solitary line, things can change at any time. I mean did you really expect politicians to get agreement on 3 tram lines costing £1bn all at once?

Of course if the idiotic Labour council hadn't put the tolls out to a referendum which was doomed to failure, things might have been very different.
90

Plantagenet,

14/07/2008 23:18:26
114. Plantaganet??? I've never planted a gannet in my life, what would my ancestor Richard the Liontart (yes I said tart) have thought of that.
91

Jed Smith,

Moscow 15/07/2008 00:39:04
#113 - I wrote an amusing 500 word response to your post but the server timed out and it disappeared into cyberspace.

So, here's the concise response: the promised £1.30 fare already looks like a hollow promise. I reckon it will be £2.20 - at least. If (and it's a microscopic 'if') the fare is more than £1.30, I'm going to ask TIE if the rest of their calculations were as daft as that one.
92

Ian down under,

Kawerau 15/07/2008 04:37:45
#110 Say it quietly, Betamax lives. It is still used by many pro-film makers and they call it betacam. It will probably disappear once the full takeover by digital is complete.
#113 You are correct and #111 you too are correct. I fully support the idea of the trams but I have reservations about it not being planned as a more comprehensive network and I still think it should be underground in the city centre partly to allow the trams to run more efectively and more frequently. This would need more initial digging but the result would be worth it. We will still need a better rail network and we will still need buses but we need them all to work together as one unit even if different bits are owned separately. Franchise whole bus routes to 1 operator but enforce minimum service standards strictly and sack them if they don't shape up.
93

Webbie,

mullingar 15/07/2008 10:39:09
After ALL of Scotland told you that you didn't want or need trams now that you have them you finally agree with the rest of the country.
Remember when a politician wants it he makes you think it is for your own good that you get it......
94

Julian.,

edinburgh 15/07/2008 22:36:56
#117, Ian,

Thanks for that. But as I said it would have been political suicide to plan a network all at once. Don't you think it was hard enough getting 1 line passed. Anyway, it's a good starting point for a network if and when that ever happens.

As for going underground. Yes great, and why don't we have a 15 minute Maglev to Glasgow while we're at it. Only problem is everyone in Scotland needs to agree to stump up an extra few grand.
95

Shurley,

C5 Owners Club 16/07/2008 08:50:14
# 110

Name those who protested against the C5....addresses please, we will not rest until they are silenced (or at least on a tram and off our roads)
96

Jed Smith,

Moscow 17/07/2008 03:55:38
#120

Terry Oiletduck, 665 Acacia Avenue, Tranent

Phyllis 'Bamstick' O'ZX81, 20014 Merkin Boulevard, Orlando, FL 32043

The Reverend Councillor Beardy Rasputin, Keir Hardie Avenue, Paisley PA1 FU2

Mr John Gibson (no relation), Great Function St, Leith EH6 FU2

Mrs Bordon Grown, The Old Glue Works, Kirkcaldy, KY1 JE11

Wolfgang McFlur c/o The Pavement, Debenhams Princes St EH2 FU1/2/3/4 (funf sechs sieben acht)

Darren Scalextric, Conduit St, Toledo, Ohio

Iva Pedalcar, Dunoon

Gloria Stitts, Wapping

97

Shurley,

Orlando first 17/07/2008 12:30:53
Thanks Jed, don't tell anyone I'm on route, my C5 isn't that fast and I don't want to give them a head start
98

Bob 2,

17/07/2008 13:05:25
117

Lothian Buses already do that, they offer:

City Wide Services (various times I know)
City Wide Travel Ticket
99

Bob 2,

17/07/2008 13:09:21
109

on the other hand in Midlothian, they built the New Dalkeith School Campus on the East Side of the Town, away from any regular bus route and walking distance

Result Chaos every morning with a stream of cars dropping off kids to lazy to walk
100

tumshie heid,

20/07/2008 22:23:39
##104
Quite amusing that you call opponents of a transport system that was considered outdated 50 years ago luddites.
Trams are a ludicrous waste of money.

 

Comment on this Story

 

In order to post comments you must Register or Sign In

 
 
 
  

 
 

Featured Advertising



Sister Newspapers:
Press Complaints Commission

This website and its associated newspaper adheres to the Press Complaints Commission’s Code of Practice. If you have a complaint about editorial content which relates to inaccuracy or intrusion, then contact the Editor by clicking here.

If you remain dissatisfied with the response provided then you can contact the PCC by clicking here.