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Tram chiefs agree to be first UK network to carry bicycles

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Published Date: 25 November 2008
THE Capital's trams are to be the first in the UK to carry bikes following a campaign by city cyclists.
Trams chiefs have agreed to carry bikes on a trial basis once the £512 million line has been up and running for a year or so.

It means Edinburgh will become the first city in the UK to allow bikes on trams, although the practice is common in the U
S and in mainland Europe.

Gary Bell, a representative of the campaign group Spokes, which has been lobbying for the move, said: "This is excellent news for Edinburgh because it will really show that the tram project is about linking in with other forms of transport.

"While it will be new in Britain, it's common practice elsewhere in the world.

"We don't expect cyclists to be using trams a lot but, for off-peak use especially, the trams will be very attractive for longer journeys. Line 1 covers quite a substantial part of the city and it will be an attractive option for cyclists wanting to travel out to the west of Edinburgh and the airport."

Spokes said it would press for the trials to be carried out at the earliest possible opportunity.

Last year, a report published by Transport Edinburgh Limited – the company that will run the bus and tram network – ruled out carrying bikes on trams for safety reasons.

But a TEL spokesman said there were now plans for trials in either 2012 or 2013 once the trams are in place and reliable passenger numbers have been established.

TEL's Alastair Richards said: "We are committed to off-peak trials as soon as usage reaches a steady state with sufficient experience built up and a quick system for safe retention of bicycles has been devised and approved for trials in public operation.

"TEL are keen to explore all means to improve public transport integration with sustainable transport modes."

Green councillors had put a motion to the city council last year calling for bikes to be allowed on the city's tram system.

The majority of tram stops west of Haymarket and north of Picardy Place are also expected to have cycle parking facilities where people can leave their bikes.

Green councillor Steve Burgess said: "This is very welcome news. Bikes go on trams in other countries, so we know it can be done.

"We want to try and maximise the number of people using the tram system and allowing cyclists on will help to do that."





The full article contains 426 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 25 November 2008 10:34 AM
  • Source: Edinburgh Evening News
  • Location: Edinburgh
 
1

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 11:19:45
Allow able-bodied cyclists on trams, but ban prams carrying babies who can't walk from buses. Yeah, that makes sense.
2

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 11:26:14
I think this is good news.

I'm surprised that a Scotsman story with the word "bicycles" in it hasn't attracted at least 100 comments yet - after all, it was posted almost half an hour ago.
3

The Judge,

25/11/2008 11:26:39
Quick try and get a few green councillors on board before they cancel the project in January we need all the votes we can get.

A few New Labour councillors are turning their backs to the tramLINE, even they know it'll cost them their seats at the next election.

Desperate measures by a desperate company.

The SPOKES person is quite funny though, he's all excited because there might be a trial in 5 years time!
4

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 11:36:12
Not that I have anything against cyclists, but I am wondering why the will need to go on trams anyway? Don't they already have a mode of transport, which is healthier and more environmentally sound?

Still don't see why able, fit adult people with a wheeled mode of transport can take their vehicle onto one mode of public transport, while delicate, still developing, unable to walk babies can't take their wheeled form of tranport onto another mode of public transport.

Or will only folding bikes be allowed on trams?

Consistent policy would be nice. But, of course, babies don't have a lobby or a vote.
5

allknowing,

25/11/2008 11:39:55
"network in the UK to carry bikes following a campaign by city cyclists."

Erm.. what network, you mean line right!!

Why these stinky people cant cycle instead of letting everyone else have to smell their BO and tip toe around their muddy bikes, is beyond me!!!

If you want to cycle, then cycle. Stop trying to have your pie and eat it!!!!


Menace the lot of you!
6

,

25/11/2008 11:53:18
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
7

Duncan in Edinburgh,

25/11/2008 11:54:03
#1 and #4 you are either being deliberately idiotic or you are an idiot. There is no connection between the two issues. And prams have never been "banned" from buses. Never. Stop peddling nonsense.
8

Anth,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 11:56:02
The way other countries do it is usually to have a rack mounted on the outside of the tram/bus. This can take 3-4 bikes, completely out of the way of passengers since they're not actually 'on-board'. Mind you, it would be interesting to see kids in buggies mounted this way...
9

allknowing,

25/11/2008 11:56:40
#6

So you thinks its acceptable to come on board a tram with commuters, while wet, smelling og BO, and clogging up space with a bike?????

And there you go again, two lies in one sentence. You cant help yourself.

Hows the girlfriend these days???
10

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 11:57:16
#7, at least they didn't mention cyclists and red lights.
11

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 11:58:49
What the hell is the point of putting a bike on a tram?
12

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 11:58:52
#8, I've never seen a tram with an external bike rack. Buses, yes. But buses aren't trams as some posters here seem not to realise.
13

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 11:59:28
#11, the same as putting it on a train. Or a bus. Whch people do.
14

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 12:02:00
#7

Erm, prams HAVE been banned from buses. Maybe you missed it...it was mentioned in the EEN once or twice.

Folding buggies are allowed, but non-folding prams are banned by Lothian Buses.

You don't see an inconsistency in allowing non-folding bikes on trams, while banning non-folding prams from buses?

There is an idiot around here, but it ain't me. I suggest you stop swallowing all ECC/TIE/LB PR hook line and sinker, and develop some independent thought.
15

Anth,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 12:04:45
Although it's likely that trams will allow prams on as well - they are, as Brad says, very different from buses.

It's still a white elephant but just cos the prams are banned on buses doesn't mean they will be on trams.

Personally I'll be sticking to my bike rather than getting on the tram with it. Unlikely to get a seat anyway next to allknowing's beer gut...
16

lulach mac gille coemgain,

25/11/2008 12:06:31
Great - oot o the Scottish Exec oafices - on tae yer bike - ontae the tram - oaf the tram - ontae yer bike - intae the airport terminal - ontae the plane - oaf the plane - on yer bike - doon tae the Parliament oafices - then repeat in reverse - what a life eh ?
17

LUVMACITY,

iN THE LOBBY 25/11/2008 12:07:58
Surely the purpose of a bike is riding it & not using other means of transport. It makes no sense.
18

,

25/11/2008 12:08:36
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
19

Artemis,

25/11/2008 12:08:46
I think the point is that some people would cycle at either end of their tram journey but wouldn't manage the whole thing by bike. Isn't it better that they cycle to the tram stop - no need to get sweaty and smelly if they a) go slowly enough and b) use deodorant - then store the bike on the external rack on the tram, and when the tram gets to wherever they want to get off, then get off, and cycle to their final destination - rather than driving the whole way?

Let's face it, some of you won't be happy until cyclists are banned from everywhere except mountain biking tracks and velodromes. Some of you just hate cyclists and it doesn't matter what the news is, it's just an excuse for you to spout your bile. Still, if you're posting hate on here, you're not out running cyclists over with your cars.
20

Arrow,

edinbrugh 25/11/2008 12:10:30
so your bike is on a rack with, say, 3 or 4 others who may (or may not) wish to alight at the same stop as you. do they have to come off, remove their bikes to let you get your off. or are they locked on and the passengers wait while the lycra clad ones unlock and unload (as opposed to load and lock? or is there a cunning arrangment proposed.
21

Snails dont like curry and chips,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 12:10:58
Everybody will need to take a bike with them if they get on a tram - they stop nowhere near where anyone wants to go!
22

Dileas,

25/11/2008 12:11:20
`Gary Bell, a representative of the campaign group Spokes, which has been lobbying for the move, said: "This is excellent news for Edinburgh because it will really show that the tram project is about linking in with other forms of transport."'

Other forms of transport apart from bicycles? Oh, I forgot - the cyclist lobby is tunnel vision - there are only two forms - public transport and filthy, oily bikes with their filthy, oily, smelly riders.

And prams are such an inconvenience - they keep getting in the way of the bikes, blocking the pavement all the time!
23

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 12:11:55
#17, so I can't cycle to the station and get on a train with my bike? What if I were to cycle to work in nice weather without waterproofs and then it's bucketing on the way home. Or I have a puncture and have forgotten to take a repair kit? What if I just can't be bothered cycling one way?

Why not just let people do as they wish? What about downloadable ringtones? Or urban 4x4s? Or Ugg boots? I don't see the point of those - but I'm not going on about it!
24

Mallory,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 12:13:26
Is there any truth in a rumour going around Leith Walk that the wrong seals have been installed on replaced mains water piping and that repairs will require further excavations?
25

,

25/11/2008 12:13:58
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
26

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 12:14:29
#22, should Spokes comment on maritime freight?
27

Anth,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 12:14:42
Hey Mallory, I saw your post on yesterday's story late on about cyclists sitting a test to show they're competent, I'm still wondering what age that test should be sat at though? It's a serious question, what age should people not be allowed to ride before?
28

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 12:15:10
#25, they should have used walruses
29

LUVMACITY,

iN THE LOBBY 25/11/2008 12:17:53
23* Carry your waterproofs at times as it tends to rain quite often in Scotland. Anyone with a brain would always carry a repair kit. You could also get a job in Weegieland saving you travelling to this wonderful city.
30

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 12:18:01
#27

I've been thinking about this. Under the age of 16, allowed to ride on pavement with a helmet.

16 and over, have to pass cycle license test before being allowed on the roads.

Just off the top off my head. No doubt there will be issues / complications that I haven't taken into account (not least the concern about some 14/15 year olds tearing about on pavements, scaring grannies).
31

LUVMACITY,

EDINBURGH 25/11/2008 12:18:55
25* If you are going abroad surely a plane would suffice.
32

Bring Back Poll Tax,

25/11/2008 12:19:58
So long as the bicycle is charged for at a rate that represents the 4 passengers who now can't stand where it's taking up space, then that's OK.
33

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 12:21:08
#30

Oh, and there would also have to be some kind of exception to allow adults to ride on the pavement if accompanying an under-age child on their own bike.
34

allknowing,

25/11/2008 12:21:16
#18 you seem to know a lot about vitara drivers, how is that???

If you want to share a tram with someone stinking to high heavens, good for you, but for most decent people, they dont!

Anyway, just so everyone sees this, I will leave these forums for eternity, never to post again, if Foo can show us all where i said i own a vitara. All he has to do, is google 'allknowing edinburgh news' and look for posts regarding the pram banning from lothian buses, 10 mins work. Come on Foo, do your fellow posters a favour and do it. What are you hiding from???

Or perhaps you just tell lies, better left ignored!!!

35

Thomas the Tank,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 12:21:19
#3, yep, I noticed the wee smiley-faced spokes loony getting all excited and dribbling down his lycra just because TIE has 'promised' to have a trial of carrying bikes on the tramLINE anything up to 5 years in the future. If it ever runs, that is.
But if it's as reliable a 'promise' as all the other Lies TIE have 'promised', there could be a lot of sad wee spokes faces.
36

,

25/11/2008 12:21:29
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
37

everything you do is probably a Balloon,

25/11/2008 12:22:02
Well , youve managed to have both a whinge and a greet about something which can only really be considered good news.

As for Trams with bike racks on the back.. erm
Nah.

It would slow things down a tad to secure them.

Complete tripe infact

unless you are talking about Moldova or somewhere equally ridiculous.
38

Cumberland Sausage,

25/11/2008 12:26:33
allknowing and Foo - the sexual tension between you two is quite intoxicating!
39

,

25/11/2008 12:27:06
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
40

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 12:28:09
#29, not everyone is as wise as you though.
41

allknowing,

25/11/2008 12:29:49
#40

Come on, just show us all where i said i own one.

Its so simple even you could do it!!!

You're just looking daft now, like a silly boy. Go and play with the buses, or should that now be trams!!
42

,

25/11/2008 12:32:48
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
43

Council Insider,

Council HQ 25/11/2008 12:34:36
#24. No
44

David Harrington,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 12:35:54
Excellent news - this is good work by Spokes again. There is a huge difference between a tram and a bus and as this will be off-peak it will make no difference to other passengers.
45

allknowing,

25/11/2008 12:36:10
#42, and you still dig your hole deeper.

I can release you from my 'bragging'. All you have to do is show us where I said i own one.

Its sooooo simple!!!!

You have time to sit and post on here for 37 minutes, i'm sure you can afford 10 mins to look it up. Just think, you'd be a hero on here!!!!!

However, back to reality, you know your sinking, so lets make more lies up!!!
46

Calum Crubag,

25/11/2008 12:39:44
Better still - lets get proper cycle lanes. On Leith Walk, even the green ways lane is going to make room for the trams. Lets get First Scotland providing proper cycle areas on trains. Much more important than going on trams.
47

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 12:41:24
#43, wrong colour of seals then?
48

Brendan,

25/11/2008 12:41:59
It's not a tram network it's a tram line - a couple of stops.

You could cycle the distance quicker than jumping off the bike, getting in the Q, loading the bike, unloading the bike etc.

When I say quicker, I mean if you use the pavements, skip red lights etc as per the norm
49

everything you do is probably a Balloon,

25/11/2008 12:42:35
46 true.
50

everything you do is probably a Balloon,

25/11/2008 12:44:09
With regards to people askig why someone would want to take a bike on the tram

A) Maybe they want to go and cycle somewhere else , somewhere more pretty and /or flat. Life isnt all hardship

B) Maybe just to block space for wheelchairs and prams

C) maybe just because .
51

everything you do is probably a Balloon,

25/11/2008 12:45:00
48 is there only going to be two stops now ?

Really ? Are you sure or are you just a miserable halfwit ?
52

,

25/11/2008 12:51:29
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
53

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 12:51:53
#51, yes, two stops. One at either end. Everything else is just a pause.
54

everything you do is probably a Balloon,

25/11/2008 12:53:35
Well i hope people can get off and on and back off again and off and on is all im saying , quickly.
55

allknowing,

25/11/2008 12:55:22
#52 better that than telling lies, AND, impersonating me too!!!! Very sad!
56

Brian Ferrari,

25/11/2008 12:55:34
Sad thing is that allknowing was actually dreaming about trading in his Allegro for a Vitara once he had saved up enough.

Anyway, back to bikes and BO. Surely the answer is to have grab handles on the trams for cyclists to hang on to. That way they can join and alight at a time of their pleasing.
57

Bill MacD,

25/11/2008 12:56:04
Hey - a story with BOTH the stupid-headed motor-maniacs' two great hate objects, trams and bikes. Well done on stirring up the vitriol, Evening News.
58

Brad,

Glasgow 25/11/2008 12:59:43
#56, I think ro-ro, like ferries, or the bus in The Italian Job...
59

scotsol,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 13:09:23
#3 - God, here he is again, Judge Cocklecarrot and his prophecies of doom. Rest assured, m'lud, I have diaried it forward to the end of January to remind you of your asinine predictions when they are proved wrong again, after which I expect you to explode on your own wind.
60

Bob 2,

25/11/2008 13:09:34
hold on, is the whole point of cycling not to get you fit and out in the elements ?

defeats the purpose of having a bike if you are going to use public transport
61

Son of Gramsci,

Edina 25/11/2008 13:10:42
I'll be gobsmacked if the tram can get from Ocean Terminal to Haymarket within 10 minutes of the time I can do on a bike. The bus takes at least twice as long.

Incidentally, have you any idea how much longer this journey takes on a bike if you stop for every red light?
62

Bob 2,

25/11/2008 13:10:56
will they allow tandems or these bikes with "trailers" on board.

where will it stop?
63

,

25/11/2008 13:11:31
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
64

Bob 2,

25/11/2008 13:12:41
Line 1 covers quite a substantial part of the city and it will be an attractive option for cyclists wanting to travel out to the west of Edinburgh and the airport."

good TIE PR
65

Bob 2,

25/11/2008 13:13:25
But a TEL spokesman said there were now plans for trials in either 2012 or 2013 once the trams are in place and reliable passenger numbers have been established.

aren't they starting in 2011?
66

Bob 2,

25/11/2008 13:26:52
Mario

63 everything you do is probably a Balloon,25/11/2008 13:11:31
bob you are a tw@ , for the reason i outlined at 50a).

Thanks.
mario

Mario
Glad to see your one of the old name callers, stick to Commenting.
which Mario are You?
Bob
67

Council Insider,

Council HQ 25/11/2008 13:39:00
#47. No
68

Mallory,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 13:41:41
In reply to Anth (#27)

Surely that would be up to the parent(s)to decide?
69

Duncan in Edinburgh,

25/11/2008 13:47:04
#14 For something to be banned, it needs to previously have been allowed. Fixed frame prams have *never* been allowed on Lothian buses. It is supremely ironic that the introduction of a new policy allowing foldable buggies onto buses has been turned into a "ban" on other types of buggies. What LB did was to *improve* facilities for parents with young children, and yet people like you attack them claiming they are *restricting* them. Ridiculous, idiotic, and very tiresome.
70

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 13:48:28
#71

If you believe that load of old nonsense, then I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you.
71

Anth,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 13:48:31
#70 Mallory

So the parents decide when their children can sit a test to get a licence to ride a bike? I actually prefer Skip's selection back up-thread.

Although I think 16 is a bit high as a limit. Personally I'd maybe say 10-11. There were loads of kids under 16 on pedal for Scotland this year who would have to do it all by pavement, but they wouldn't be able to because a lot of the route is country roads...
72

Maxibus,

25/11/2008 13:52:40
Bob we all know one line does not a network make so lets all start campaigning for more lines.
In Nottingham it took a year for the passenger numbers to settle down as all the little old ladies were taking a ride to see where it went but not when it was raining and/or cold.
73

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 13:58:17
#57 Bill MacD

"Hey - a story with BOTH the stupid-headed motor-maniacs' two great hate objects, trams and bikes."

Actually, a large percentage of posts questioning the trams are from users of public transport. Most people's objections to this scheme are based upon the cost to the taxpayer, and the fact that the tram construction is having a serious impace on bus services.

That's before you even get into the arguments about future funding shortfalls having to be met by the Council Tax payer (i.e. more cutbacks on other essential services), or subsidised by increased fares on Lothian Buses.

Personally, my current preferred choices for travel to/from/around Edinburgh are:

1) By foot
2) By rail
3) By bus
4) By bike
5) By taxi

Never ever ever do I use a car to travel to/from/around Edinburgh.

People are objecting to this project for many reasons, but the argument that they are all some kind of petrol-obsessed junkies is nonsense. A convenient, overly simplistic argument from people who have no other way to justify the wrong project, at the wrong time, for the wrong city, for the wrong (excessive) cost. The tramline will potentially benefit only a tiny percentage of the population, while causing a negative impact for a great many more, all at our collective expense.
74

I love to eat Sellotape,

25/11/2008 13:59:09
The challenge for the Evening News is to run a story about trams that does not attract at least 75 comments by 2:00pm, 93% of which are absolute garbage (including this one). Here are some potential headlines

- MAN OVERHEAD DISCUSSING TRAMS AT PRINCES STREET M & S
- COUNCIL TO DEBATE CORRECT PRONUNCIATION OF WORD "TRAM"
- SHADOW FOREIGN SECRETARY MAKES NO COMMENT ON TRAMS
- EPISODE OF "EMMERDALE" TO FEATURE IMAGE OF TRAM
- TRAMS NOT EXPECTED TO RUN ON SHAVING FOAM

75

Son of Gramsci,

Edina 25/11/2008 14:00:09
A licence for cycling would be a completely disproportianate measure. Just how many injuries are caused to other people by cyclists every year? Almost none. May as well licence people for walking and/or running.
76

The Judge,

25/11/2008 14:01:30
#59 #3 - God, here he is again, Judge Cocklecarrot and his prophecies of doom. Rest assured, m'lud, I have diaried it forward to the end of January to remind you of your asinine predictions when they are proved wrong again, after which I expect you to explode on your own wind.

---------

When have I been wrong? Every single thing I've predicted about the tramLINE has come true.


I was right about Market St, I was(am)right about the wrong pipe in Shandwick Pl and the wrong pipework in Leith Walk. I was right when I predicted that the costs would rise, I predicted that they'd never be able to close Princes St, I predicted long ago that it was already months behind schedule without a single inch of line being laid when others laughed.

You've put a post on a diddy newspaper in your diary? FFS mate get a life for god sake.

The tramLINE is dead we're just waiting on them announcing a date for the funeral.
77

Brian Ferrari,

25/11/2008 14:03:05
#76

Very interesting. But did you know that TRAMS is SMART backwords.

Apposite or ironic - I don't know which.
78

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 14:04:29
#73

Yes, the age limit would beed careful thought. I worry about 10-11 year olds riding solo on the roads though. I appreciate that you need to develop road-awareness in real situations at some point, but I would tend to think that 10-11 is too young. Maybe some kind of provision that children of a certain age can ride on roads, under supervision of an adult, under some kind of "provisional" type scheme similar to that for learner drivers might be an option?
79

Anth,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 14:06:14
I really must stop agreeing with Skip, but yep, at #75 I disagree with the trams for a variety of reasons, some of which he's mentioned, and I ride everywhere in the city and come on here to spout about cycling far too much. I love my car, I love driving, but I wouldn't come anywhere near the centre of the city in it - no fun whatsoever!
80

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 14:08:54
#81 Anth

"I really must stop agreeing with Skip."

Go on....you know you love it really! ;-)
81

Thomas the Tank,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 14:13:07
#77 - Don't joke about 'pedestrian licences' - did our very own cooncillor Jason Rust (must have seen him -sticky-oot ears, looks about 14?) not propose slow and fast walking lanes in Princes Street? Something like this would give him another idea for a ridiculous 'Look at ME' story in the Embra Evening Chip-Wrapper.
82

Dunedinhen,

Darlington 25/11/2008 14:18:17
the story is b*ll**ks as I have used the trams in sheffield and see lots of bikes on the tram. There won't be a conductor so if you can get another mode of transport on why stop at a bike. smart cars are quite small...
83

Duncan in Edinburgh,

25/11/2008 14:27:17
#72 Bizarre response. What's your problem? I'm right.
84

Son of Gramsci,

Embra 25/11/2008 14:30:59
#84 Other modes of transport to take on a tram:-

- pogo stick;
- space hopper;
- roller blades;
- scooter;
- pedal car;
- trike;
- mule;
- surf board;
- coracle;
- unicycle;
- skateboard;
- horse;
- huskies and sley;

85

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 14:33:03
#85

No, you're wrong. But I'm not going to bother explaining why you are wrong.

I can gift you knowledge, but I cannot gift you understanding.
86

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 14:36:54
....oh alright, I'll use a comparison to point out why you are wrong.

For something to be banned, it needs to previously have been allowed. People of colour have *never* been allowed on Alabama Buses. It is supremely ironic that the introduction of a new policy allowing people of colour onto buses has been turned into a "ban" on people of colour sitting at the front of buses. What Alabama did was to *improve* facilities for people of colour, and yet people like you attack them claiming they are *restricting* them. Ridiculous, idiotic, and very tiresome.
87

Decent,

25/11/2008 14:37:38
In Switzerland you can take a car on the train. Or maybe it was a motorbike - can't quite remember it was a long time ago.
88

Ronster,

edinburgh 25/11/2008 14:38:45
mon the trams !

mon the cyclists !!

Mon the Albourg !!!
89

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 14:39:18
If I was in a pub with you lot I would leave.
90

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 14:41:03
#91

And we'd be glad about it. Then we'd all talk about you behind your back.
91

roadstohell,

25/11/2008 14:41:20
The way I see it, these 2 snippets of news, to show off a mock up of a tram,(well 2/5th of a tram actually) and to consider a trial of allowing bicycles on the trams, are both extremely desperate attempts by TIE/TEL etc to boost support for the patently unpopulor and troubled tram project.
To be honest, I don't think either will work.

I know that Spokes and other "green" pressure groups were wooed and won over by the Tram planners, with promises of "green" things. Even this "victory" for spokes is dependant on a large numbe of conditions, so SPOKES a word of advice, don't hold your breath.
I personally think that you haven't got a hope in hell of getting what you want, EVEN if a tram finally ever does run. You are being lied to systematically and cynically by TIE/TEL,in order to maintain the support of the "green" lobby.

As to how the bicycles might be carried, well I can see too much resistance from non cycling passengers to having them carried inside the vehicle., sorry if you don't like that or you feel persecuted etc etc but that will be the way of it.
By the same token I can't see TIE/TEL letting their sleek modern vehicles become cluttered with external racks. I know that this occurs abroad on tram systems with the old style, shoogly rattly cars, but I doube it would be countenanced here. There are safety & security issues with having your bike loaded outside the car, bicycles are easily damaged, they are known to fall off/out of the racks and finally gangs of scallys regularly nick all the bikes in the racks before the owners can react :0/

Nope, I see this as the desperate floundering of a doomed project trying to keep itself afloat and retain and recruit support, I think this will be unsuccesful


92

Linmal,

Livingston 25/11/2008 14:44:06
Is there to be no escape from these mad cyclists? Well at least I don't have to be in Edinburgh at weekends. Don't get me wrong, I was brought up in the City and love the place but I used to wish I could come back. Now the more I see of it, the more glad I am that I live somewhere without all these problems, trams, cyclists and irate motorists.
93

Decent,

25/11/2008 14:47:18
Well I'd rather have trams, cyclists and irate motorists than one-armed cross-eyed inbreds.
94

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 14:47:28
92 Then I would burst back in again with a big bunch of dolly bords which i wouldnt bring over to your sad table.
95

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 14:48:07
94 Yes, I'd much rather live in Livingston also.

ffs etc.
96

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 14:48:49
#96

We'd have moved on by then, without telling you where we were going.
97

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 14:53:20
98 I would have already put stink bombs in your house.
98

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 14:54:30
Then realised that they werent needed as you live in a stinky, stoory hoose.
99

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 14:57:22
#99

You wouldn't get past the electric fence. And, if you did, the gamekeeper would probably shoot you on sight.
100

Cod,

25/11/2008 15:00:11
In Switzerland you can eat cheese. I'm rather fondue that.
101

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:05:33
Your gamekeepper looks after your subbutteo and Buckaroo.

Your gamekeeper is your mum.
102

roadstohell,

25/11/2008 15:08:31
"we dont expect huge nunbers for bike carriage,but it will be excellent for situations like air visitors arriving with bikes,commuters or shoppers caught by downpour or puncture,even for the less-fit climbing from Leith up to Princes street"

There you go, SPOKES supports the cost of £500 Million to support air travel, supply a shelter for cyclists from bad weather and a "bike lift" up Leith walk, excellent use of all that money, thanks Spokes
103

Old Cartha Boy,

25/11/2008 15:08:38
Summary of story - tram trials for bikes to start in 5 years time! Hardly a "hold the front page" article - and when in 2013 will TIE be saying the lines will be completed?
104

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 15:08:47
Yes, those are among my gamekeeper's duties.

My gamekeeper is YOUR mum.
105

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:09:43
Its good to know that your mum is on the games.
106

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:11:20
107 Cheeses arent born. They cant be babies.

For the love of god what is wrong with you people ?
107

roadstohell,

25/11/2008 15:13:36
110# ha what do you know ?
next you'll say there is no Santa Claus
108

roadstohell,

25/11/2008 15:14:07
Or that the nice Tram people are really evil pixies
109

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 15:14:45
#109

My dad can run faster than your dad.
110

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 15:18:57
#115

Gott in Himmel!
111

roadstohell,

25/11/2008 15:21:09
My dad shot down 5 fokkers in the war, but those fokkers were messchersmits !
112

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:21:33
114. That genuinely funny , cheers.

My cousin is in the army and he will get all the army to come to your houses and batter you all if you dont shutup. He also has some friends in the US marines and the Russians and Chinese so just shutup before you try and say you could batter me and my dad.
113

Peter - very disappointed/concerned,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 15:29:52


On the surface of it this appears to be a not unreasonable idea.

However, this report does not state whether or not cyclists will have to pay a fee for the transportation of a bike(s) by the tram system.

I don't know if it stll applies, but it used to be the rule that you had to pay an additional fee for large objects such as a set of golf clubs if you were travelling by public transport. Dogs also had to be paid for - does anyone know if these rules still apply?

The question must also be raised as to what happens if the tram becomes full of passengers and several bikes are occupying passeneger space, will the cyclists and their bikes then be ejected so that other passengers can board?

114

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:30:04
thats because its an imaginary house. you actually with with Sally Army.
115

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:31:07
Peter , what have bikes on trams got to do with you ? Is every propsal in the UK submitted to you for approval first ?

No it isnt. Your comment was at best futile and silly.
116

Brian Ferrari,

25/11/2008 15:36:01
More to the point, what have bikes on trams got to do with this thread?
117

Council Insider,

Council HQ 25/11/2008 15:38:08
I want to ride my bicycle, I want to ride my bike.
118

Cramondo,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 15:38:15
I'd have thought this article would stimulate few comments.

All the anti-tram people couldn't care who or what gets to go on trams, so should have nothing to say.

All the anti-cyclist people couldn't care what cyclists do with their bikes, so no need to comment either.

And the pro-pram people would have noticed that a tram is not a bus so could devote more time to their babies and less to this discussion.

All that's left is for the pro-tram, pro-bike, pram-friendly minority (including me) to say "what a good idea and anyway it's just a trial so no harm done".

So what a surprise that a story about trams and bikes should attract so much attention.
119

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:39:00
120 Plus , Dogs have no money.
120

Brian Ferrari,

25/11/2008 15:42:09
#125

I'm not pro-tram, or even pro-am, I'm not even pro anti-tram. I am anti pro-tram and pro anti-am.
121

Brian Ferrari,

25/11/2008 15:45:27
#126

Round here dogs have money. Oh yes. Some even try to buy you a drink.
122

Decent,

25/11/2008 15:47:53
My dogs got more money than your dog. And one of these silly little tartan coats. Goes to the tartan tat shops.
123

Duncan in Edinburgh,

25/11/2008 15:48:57
#88 If you genuinely think that example is apposite then I pity you for your foolishness. Otherwise I dismiss you for you nonsense.
124

,

25/11/2008 15:49:05
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
125

Peter - very disappointed/concerned,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 15:50:10
#126 The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

" Dogs have no money."

I am sure that you are in an exact position to know.

You're responses are (sadly) typical of those 'cyclists' who want everything for nothing.

126

,

25/11/2008 15:51:03
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
127

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 15:52:06
Peter if you can give me an example of a dog which carries money around and goes on trams I am all ears.
128

Skip McClendon,

25/11/2008 15:53:09
#13o

It was as apposite as any of your blinkered recanting of pro-tram TIE/ECC/LB press releases.

Now begone, oh slavish follower of the urination of public millions down the tramline drain.
129

tumshie heid,

25/11/2008 15:53:14
This is just more desperate pr spin to try and rescue the floundering tram line.
A question for Gary Bell the spokes spokesman..
Why the hell would you get on the tram to the airport with a bicycle?
130

Brian Ferrari,

25/11/2008 15:53:16
#134

Cathy Jamieson in Brussels
131

,

25/11/2008 15:54:16
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
132

Peter - very disappointed/concerned,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 15:54:40
One good thing about cyclists and bikes on trams, at least they wouldn't be cycling on pavements while in transit.

Have the police done anything about the pavement cyclists as they were supposed to be having a 'crack-down' around now.

Pigs might fly I suppose.

133

Peter - very disappointed/concerned,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 15:57:29
#134 The Leith Cowboy

"If you can give me an example of a dog which carries money around and goes on trams I am all ears."

Sorry Cowboy, I thought that you might be such an example yourself.

Might give you 'paws' for thought?



134

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 25/11/2008 16:03:13
sure, a dog which types on websites , carries money and goes on trams.
135

Peter - very disappointed/concerned,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 16:09:37
#142 The Leith Cowboy

There are some 'clever' dogs around don't you know?
136

Mallory,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 16:24:10
Reply to Council Insider #43

Thanks you - I've passed your reply on the water engineer who mentioned it to me..
137

Council Insider,

On A Tram To The Gyle 25/11/2008 16:24:39
Question: What do you call a dog with wings?

Clue: She made good vegetable lasagne.

138

Mallory,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 16:28:58
Reply to Anth #73

As I don't have kids it seemed stupid to usurp parental reasponsibility.
139

Mallory,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 16:30:17
Why not put grab rails on the sides of the trams - cyclists can then hitch a ride for free...
140

Duncan in Edinburgh,

25/11/2008 16:52:38
#135 What is it that you think "recanting" means? Perhaps you ought to look it up. Tube.
141

sazm,

barnton 25/11/2008 17:07:06
My partner is a cyclist but when he goes out he intends to cycle, not jump on a tram!!
142

Hexagon Fun,

25/11/2008 17:10:58
Im currently in england , 500 years ago.
143

an interested party,

25/11/2008 17:13:51
network?

interesting use of the world

route perhaps
144

Bob 2,

25/11/2008 17:35:41
153

network?

interesting use of the world

route perhaps


LINE - yes
145

Bob 2,

25/11/2008 17:38:32
139
Peter - very disappointed/concerned,
Edinburgh 25/11/2008 15:54:40
One good thing about cyclists and bikes on trams, at least they wouldn't be cycling on pavements while in transit.

Have the police done anything about the pavement cyclists as they were supposed to be having a 'crack-down' around now.

And has anyone done anything about all the CARS that DRIVE ONTO THE FOOTPATHS around Edinburgh and
a)block the way for pedestrians and people in wheelchairs
b) damage the FOOTPATHS


now what was this article about Bikes on Trams


Given the limited capacity of trams, were will they put their bikes on the roof?
146

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 17:56:38
The Auchenshuggle Cyclists Association are delighted.

147

Peter - very disappointed/concerned,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 17:57:48
#155 Bob2

Offending motorists are very often brought to task Bob, the simplest reason being that vehicles have registration numbers, cyclists do not and in many cases simply ride away from the scene of their 'accident'.

Of course, both things are wrong, i.e. careless/dangerous drivers, and equally those selfish and dangerous cyclists who cycle on pavements, go through red lights and pedestrian crossings, etc.

It is very disappointing not to see reports of offending cyclists being charged in the light of the recent police 'promise' to enforce a 'crack-down'.

I wonder if we can expect to see certain types of 'cyclist' cycle on/off the trams and shouting aggresively at any passengers who have the audacity to get in 'their' way?



148

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 17:58:16
There's a cool new band on myspace called Diminished Tramsponsibility
149

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 17:58:46
What came first: the pterodactyl or the egg?
150

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 18:01:03
"Pedaler en grand braquet
Sprint final a l'arrivee
Crevaison sur les paves
Le velo vite repare
Le peloton est regroupe
Camarades et amitie..."

.(...as the silver man of Princes Street once said, before rapairing to Milnes for a pint of lemonade.)
151

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 18:02:30
Why would you want to put a bike on a tram - surely it kind of defeats the point ?

Still the people who want trams are clearly much cleverer than us all who can't see the point in Trams either - maybe the trams are being built to take your bike to where you want it to go so you don't have to ride it there ?

It all becomes clear when you think about it !?
152

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 18:05:13
Can you take a mock bike on the trams, say a replica Eddie Merckx TdF 12 gear deraillieur made out of fibreglass, balsa wood and old beer cans?
153

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 18:08:08
This thread is like a wee tin of Spaghetti Hoops with a green smudged price sticker, covered in dust, that rolled under the freezer of Anderson's newsagents in Slateford circa 1992.
154

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 18:48:01
If the tram scheme collapsed in a forest and nobody was in the forest, like not even a bear, would the ensuing raucous crunchy noises exist?

Answers on a barking dog, or if you don't have a barking dog, a silent dog.
155

Finbarr Saunders,

25/11/2008 19:11:08
#158-160 and 162-164 - Niko Bellic - Have you been drinking or do you normally post comments like that?
156

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 19:21:30
Naw, normally just a barrage of single entendres.
157

is it me?,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 20:52:16
Niko Bellic
I can't be bothered reading through all these posts , but what's the tune for that thing at 160 ?
It's doing ma heid in.
Is it yon Ponts at D'Avignon thing ?
158

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 20:59:30
Naw
159

is it me?,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 21:03:41
Sh1te
160

is it me?,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 21:09:53
George Formby ?
161

Niko Bellic,

25/11/2008 21:21:47
No,

It's "When I'm Cleanin Windows" by Kraftwerk.
162

is it me?,

Edinburgh 25/11/2008 22:39:19
...glassic.
163

roadstohell,

26/11/2008 08:41:43
I suspect that the most likely "tram-bicycle" interface will be one of avoiding getting your wheel stuck in the tram lines !!!!
maybe they will reintroduce the wooden blocks/cobbles between the tram lines and on the crossing from pavement to tram stop !, they were soooo much fun in the wet .

Ah a whole new generation of cyclists will be baptised in the age old ,wheel bending, art of crossing tram lines, memories.........
164

Skip McClendon,

26/11/2008 09:36:56
#150 Duncan in Edinburgh

"#135 What is it that you think "recanting" means? Perhaps you ought to look it up. Tube."

Oooh...I made a typo. Is that the best you can do to counter my arguments? Pick up on a typo? Oooh, Skip typed 'recanting' when he meant to type 'recounting', therefore that proves that trams are well worth the money, and that Lothian buseses should be allowed to continue to discriminate against babies because they have always discriminated against babies, which makes it all OK...

Some of us don't clear all our posts with the ECC/LB/TIE press office before posting them, Duncster, therefore we sometimes make the odd typo.

But you know what folk who nitpick over typos on these sites, believing it makes them superior? They are tawts. Oops, another small typo there!
165

Duncan in Edinburgh,

26/11/2008 10:10:06
#174 Recant vs recount is not a typo, it's a lack of knowledge. Something you display with alarming regularity.

166

Skip McClendon,

26/11/2008 10:33:52
#175

I meant to type one word and, in full flow, I typed another by mistake.

That's a typo. Go and look it up, since you seem to like using your thesaurus at every opportunity to try to appear clever, with little success.

Me, I know what both recant AND recount mean, without having to look them up, or check with the PR office at TIE/LB/ECC.

None of which alters the fact that people who pick up on typos on here are tawts. Oops, did it again!
167

Bob 2,

26/11/2008 13:13:17
157 Peter - very disappointed/concerned,Edinburgh 25/11/2008 17:57:48
#155 Bob2

Offending motorists are very often brought to task Bob,

I've yet to see a car driver being done for DRIVING ONTO THE FOOTPATHS and PARKING on them around Edinburgh.

Every night at Jocks Lodge the same cars/vans are parked on the pavement.

Take a look along any residential street and you'll find cars parked on the FOOTPATHS


the simplest reason being that vehicles have registration numbers...have you seen some of the registration plates jsut now...never seen so many dodgy number plates in my life.....funny characters....dirt on the numbers... or the old favourite just now altering the characters with screws and sticky tape


but roll on the trams

 

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