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Anger as city financial giant moves 94 more jobs to India

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Published Date:
20 February 2007
FINANCIAL giant Scottish Widows is to outsource another 94 jobs to India, bringing the total lost from Edinburgh to 500 in the past three years.
Employees greeted the news with a mixture of disappointment and resignation, as they expressed concerns about the gradual "erosion" of the firm's headquarters.

The company, which employs 4000 people and has its headquarters on Morrison Street, has reassured workers that no one will be made redundant. It says the cuts will be made through "natural wastage" by not replacing some staff when they leave or retire, and by cutting the numbers of temporary workers.

But David Kelly, who represents the 60 per cent of workers who belong to the Amicus union, said staff were still angry.

He said: "Staff feel disappointed that the company wants to off-shore more. Every time it happens, it makes them feel slightly more insecure.

"When it first happened in 2004, staff were a little bit more upset. They still don't like it but they're resigned to it happening.

"Obviously we would have preferred these roles to stay in the UK and preferably within the Edinburgh area. We have a dialogue with the management and we are trying to mitigate it as much as we can."

Most of the jobs to be lost will be in administration and "back-office roles". None will be working in direct contact with customers. They will be transferred to India between now and June. Bosses have not yet decided exactly which jobs will be moved.

Scottish Widows has already moved more than 400 jobs to India following a pilot study in 2004. Staff were told of the latest move last week.

Mr Kelly added: "One of the reasons that they're off-shoring these roles is that they're the least satisfying roles.

"At one time, school-leavers would have done them, but people have changed. We don't really recruit school-leavers any more, and aspirations are higher."

One employee, who did not want to be named, said he was very concerned about the move.

He said: "This is not the first round of off-shoring to take place. I feel the public should be made aware of the erosion of one of Edinburgh's institutions."

Officers at Amicus have already called for a parliamentary inquiry into what they said were "increasing problems" linked to the off-shoring of financial services administration to India.

The union said last October it had serious concerns about the security of work being sent overseas by UK firms.

Mike Pringle, MSP for Edinburgh South, said: "It's extremely regrettable that any jobs are lost in Scotland. These jobs are by natural wastage, but at the end of the day it's 94 jobs that are being lost. It's less opportunities for school-leavers and graduates."

A spokesman for Scottish Widows said it had made the decision following "cost and efficiency gains" in the pilot study.

He said: "There will be no redundancies as a result. Scottish Widows is committed to keeping all staff informed throughout and will continue talking to the unions at each stage in the process."

Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 20 February 2007 12:35 PM
  • Source: Edinburgh Evening News
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Job exporting , Scottish Widows
 
1

Paul Voltaire,

www.paulvoltaire.spaces.live.com 20/02/2007 12:09:19

Soon won't be anything Scottish about Scottish Widows.

2

Young Gordon,

The Shore 20/02/2007 12:14:50

No Paul, it'll be Indian Widows...

3

Vinny,

Edinburgh 20/02/2007 12:29:55

Scottish Widows can't compete with other financial companies in Edinburgh anyway. The pay there is crap and the only way they can get the work done and still under pay their staff is to send jobs to India.

4

It's heading straight for us!,

Leith 20/02/2007 12:30:20

Wasn't Scottish Widows one of the companies who said they would pull out of Scotland altogether if we gained independence?

5

Sus E Babe,

Edin 20/02/2007 12:38:04

Funny how the Widows are shifting more jobs abroad when it was reported only a couple of weeks ago that many companies are re-patriating previously off-shored jobs back to Scotland.

6

,

20/02/2007 12:43:01
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 385099, Article id was mapped to record!
7

jim lad,

the capital 20/02/2007 12:43:25

#4
Yes that was before they were merged with Lloyd TSB and Mike Ross was CE,but it also included if Labour were elected.
#3 You're sounding off about something you don't know about, Widows are still one of the strongest and respected finance companies in the whole of the UK.

8

desparate,

Edinburgh 20/02/2007 12:48:36

I had to call LLoyds Bank last week to get the telephone number for Portobello High Street Branch.
I was 2 miles away from the branch and the person on the phone asked me to spell Portobello and Edinburgh. Alarm bells started to ring and I asked him where he was. India was the reply.
NEA WONDER I TAK A DRAM!!

9

Androsthenes,

Edinburgh 20/02/2007 12:49:01

If you use a bank and insurance company that make a point of NOT having call centres in India those that do will soon get the message.

10

Jakey Rowling,

20/02/2007 12:51:22

Another example of a cold Calcuttalated decision by Scottish Widows.

11

OffshoreRaj,

20/02/2007 12:53:45

Why are us bad name, we love data entry work, i trained as a Doktor and now i earn more do data entry, copy and paste is favourite function

12

Justy,

Edinburgh 20/02/2007 13:00:16

Surely no-one ought to complain? After all it
is pay back time according to the non-indigenous causean population!?

Justy

13

1969 , In the Sunshine,

20/02/2007 13:04:35

4, Scottish Widows are owned by Lloyds TSB , who arent very scottish.

How cheap can you get - honestly. Back office jobs of the type described dont pay much more than about 14K anyway.

Jim Lad -

Their Investment arm - SWIP has been consistently close to the worse in the whole UK - including one man and his dog operations - for some time.

Financial Giant ? I think UBS, ING , PARIBAS , Allianz might scoff at such a stupid remark, theres no gaurantee that Lloyds wont sell in the near future now they have been nursed almost back to health.

14

1969 , In the Sunshine,

20/02/2007 13:10:26

JOB AD

Back office Scottish Widows Posts :-
Banagalore 4K pa. + All the abuse you can handle.

Do you know your CTRL C from your CTRL V ? Are you willing to learn about Scottish Society, including "Fitba" "Beer" and "Fags" ? Can you talk about the Number 45 bus or about River City ?

Come join us at our state of the ark environment only 45 Miles from the Centre of Bangalore.


We offer :-

Competetive Salary (I love that one!)
Half a desk
Time off to go to the toilet once a day (please bring your own paper).

We expect :-

4 Degrees
2 PHDs
Fluent English , Hindi and Gadgie

15

Declan,

Glasgow 20/02/2007 13:21:42

What a shame. Seems that Scottish Widows are doing the opposite of many others - I worked for a huge outsourcing company and we outsourced a lot of jobs to India, Romania and Poland. Bit by bit, after continual client complaints, the jobs were transferred back to Scotland & England. It just doesn't work!

16

A Friend of Fernando Poo,

Newington 20/02/2007 13:32:51

Well, I'm going to move my Scottish Widows pension into a SIPP and do the investment myself. At least until I outsource myself to India.

17

Bob 2,

20/02/2007 13:33:39

sold down the river in the name of profit.

Its a slow rought of Jobs in this country - Between Selling Scottish Jobs Off to the Far East and the internet - who will be left to buy things if theres no jobs left in this country.

No 8. desparate - sums it up, I phoned the DELL computers Technical line and got the same response, in a queue for 30 mins - spoke to a gentleman - who went pardon cant understand you and hung up, tried again - same 30min queue.
Next gentleman had the same difficulty with our accent - 45mins on the phone sorting the problem - despite this being a next day on site service.

And charged £4 for the privilige

Of course none of the bosses jobs will be getting moved to make Scottish Widows more profit.

18

Scaramouche,

20/02/2007 13:37:07

The staff in India will work for pennies by comparison with our minimum wage.

The company doesn't care about its customers (no company does) .... it's all about PROFIT!!!

19

Clen Peapus,

Edinburgh 20/02/2007 13:37:40

If the company is renamed then I suggest "Scottish/Indian Widows/Widowers".

This is surely the best non-sexist and non-racist compromise.

(Tongue firmly in cheek!)

20

Young Gordon,

The Shore 20/02/2007 13:46:01

Thankyou 6, 11 and ultimately 14!
Made my day.

(I don't think anyone ever realised that by being 'Floated' on the Stock Exchange many years ago, would mean that quite so literally now 'shipped' over to India!!)

21

Paula,

20/02/2007 13:48:10

Well if customers aren't happy then they should find another company to deal with. That is the only way these places will get the hint that relocating to India is not customer friendly. Anyone who has struggled with a conversation where the operator can't cope when you go off script knows that.

These companies also tend to keep Indian call centres as a threat to UK workforces. If you demand decent wages, decent working conditions then the company will up and move every job to where it is cheaper.

22

1969 , In the Sunshine,

20/02/2007 13:51:07

Plus the fact that the company are legalised Theives.

Missold Endowments , Stupid interest rates on their mortages, the fact you have to pay them thousands if you pay it off early, giving people 40 year mortgages when they are already in the 40's. Oh , could tell you a few stories about these Thugs in suits.

23

DAVID,

Edinburgh 20/02/2007 14:03:43

Er, what's all this stuff and nonsense about profit? Who on earth thinks companies are in business to make a profit? Surely the raison d'etre for most companies is to lose more and more money every year?

Wake up.

24

Bien E. Bien,

20/02/2007 14:39:37

I suspect that financial service workers in Edinburgh may have to get used to this kind of outsourcing. Much of the relatively low-margin and high labour-intensity work (i.e. custody, settlements) can be translated in higher-margin work by cutting the costs of labour.

25

Mallory,

20/02/2007 14:49:57

Its unfortunately just the start. Over 60,000 jobs are predicted to offshore from the FS and call cenre sectors over the next few years,.

26

Open Minded,

A better Place 20/02/2007 15:53:37

#7 "Jim Lad says "You're sounding off about something you don't know about, Widows are still one of the strongest and respected finance companies in the whole of the UK."

Hmmm ... Well Jim Lad, I worked for "The Wids" for 33 years and saw them go from OK to unbelievable.

I have seen with my own eyes how caring (not) that company could be. As for their investment skills, how many times has one of their funds been the dog of dogs ?

27

Dod fae Orkney,

Orkney 20/02/2007 16:00:31

I used to be insured with Norwich Union until I had a claim. Phoning the call centre in India was a nightmare. Changed my insurance to Direct Line which only have UK call centres. I let NU know why I was changing. The consumer has the ultimate power.

28

Skinnybob,

Not in the pub 20/02/2007 17:33:41

I have inside information that they chose what shares to invest in by asking a chimpanzee to throw darts at a copy of the Financial Times.

The chimp is however likely to lose his position as the job is off-shored to India where an Elephant will be used..

29

Mario Antoinette aka lots of things,

20/02/2007 18:44:21

I ken you sceptic. I ken you. Must do, I worked in that psychiartic ward for 12 years. Best thing i ever did was to get booted out :)

30

Staunch,

Being John Malkovich 20/02/2007 19:16:03

Thank goodness for the Lithuanian bankers off-shoring to Edinburgh; and keeping a 131year old Edinburgh football institution alive and kicking. Globalisation - times are a changing for the good, the bad and the ugly.

31

jim lad,

the capital 21/02/2007 07:22:58

#26
Don't believe you worked in Wids for 33 years. Name the satellite buildings and your team leader,dont think you can.
My reply to #7 was in response to an obvious posting that lacked any inside knowlege.
#28 you must have been a right idiot,it takes some doing to get kicked out,what a star you must have been,and the sad part is your proud of it.
Lloyd TSB was a bank that wanted to move in on the investment/insurance market so the take over.Yes they made promises like all takeovers do ,to keep Edinburgh as the Scottish HO,job security,but slow but sure they replaced Scottish management with English ex Lloyd management and things did change for the worse in the eyes of the staff.I was on the executive of MSF UNION and we fought every move to outsource jobs are were very succesful, then MSF were amalganated with Amicus who previously were the old EEE union.Japan and China are opening Widow offices as they see Wids as a prestigious company anyway thats enough at least i can prove my credentials

32

Old Leith,

London 21/02/2007 08:26:52

It's (another) wake up call. If the most that you or your kids aspire to is a low skilled, clerical, backroom function, then you can look forward to a lifetime of poverty.
They employ better qualified, better motivated people in India and for a fraction of the cost of us UK workers.
And they are increasingly being used for higher skilled jobs.
And at the same time as we are losing jobs to them, we are also losing jobs to technology.
So the choice is whinge and live in poverty or better yourself and have some chance at a better life.
No one has a God given right to these jobs when there are folk better qualified elsewhere, who will do them cheaper and when there's technology that can take over- capitalism will always ensure the lower skilled lose out.

33

Open Minded,

A Better Place 21/02/2007 08:33:45

#26 Dear Jim,

Just in case you revisit " Yesterday's News"

I think saying "MDR" or Pegasus the Staff Magazine or that before they outsourced the Bookbinding Dept, it was located in a small Ind Est in Portobello is enough. More ?

Or how about (allegedly) a member of staff (one of the purgees) suffering from a debilitating illness, waiting outside the Old Ben Line Building (the "Departure Lounge") in the rain because of no wheelchair access. Is that enough for you ?

I also notice Jim, that you don't comment on (what SWF customers would rate most important), namely, their Investment "Performance"

Over to you Jim Lad.

34

1969 , In the Sunshine,

21/02/2007 09:37:11

31. Jim Lad.

MSF ? Didnt 80% of those lot get booted out during the 1996 Purge ? Biggest lot of crooks within the organisation..


Satellite Buildings - Benline , St Mary Street , little one off Causewayside , Melville Gate (possibly the biggest single waste of money in the companies history, though good job flogging it off to RBS).

Widows was a holiday camp for alcoholics in the '80s , hipflasks galore. To be fair many companies were back then.

I see you take the usual Edinburgh Financial Services company line on negative publicity , EG Investment Performance.

Incompetent isnt the word for their performance latterly. You shouldnt be allowed to get away with this.

35

1969 , In the Sunshine,

21/02/2007 09:40:08

"Japan and China are opening Widow offices as they see Wids as a prestigious company anyway thats enough at least i can prove my credentials"

What the Japanese and Chinese Governments are opening these offices ? Are you sure it isnt Lloyds , simply following in SL footsteps ?

36

jim lad,

the capital 21/02/2007 10:07:54

#34/#35
Thanks for your post. As i said MSF became part of Amicus so your comment is irrelevent. Yes i am sure its Wids not Lloyds. Dont understand what i am not to get away with, like yourself i commented on circumstances as they were at my time and from chums still there. If we didn't have different opinions this board would be redundant.I have tried to answer your post honestly and hope you take it in that spirit.

37

1969 , In the Sunshine,

21/02/2007 10:10:01

Evasion. Isnt illegal. Fair enough.

38

jim lad,

the capital 21/02/2007 10:35:10

#33 Sceptic Man.
Thanks for your reply.I will start by saying all i was trying to do was to establish your credentials to establish your comments were fact based. As you know by now so many people post on these boards,and it's obvious that they are chancers with no knowlege on the subject. You have indeed proven your point and for that i have no problem in publicly saying i was WRONG.You are ofcourse correct in what you say about customers and investments thats the whole point of becoming a customer. Wids like other investment houses around the globe went through a bad time which i think you will agree, my point was that they came through that and were rebuilding back to their strenghs. My chums still at Wids tell me that year on year the customer base is growing, but then there are lots of new products since i retired.In my origanal post #7, i was replying to a question from #4 and my comments to #3 still stand, On your point about the wheelchair incident at Benline,i have no knowlege, but there was no wheelchair access at that time and i don't ever remember an icident being reported. Anyway i still believe that Wids are a respected investment house, but you and anyone else are entitled to disagree.I hope this squares the circle with us and no hard feelings, because it's only opinions after all and not designed to insult. Have a nice one
Jim Lad

39

jim lad,

the capital 21/02/2007 10:46:11

#37 Sorry you feel i have been evasive ,not intentional, and i am happy to carry on our postings if you wish and we might come to an amicable agreement.

40

1969 , In the Sunshine,

21/02/2007 10:56:46

No worries Jim. Enjoy your retirement !

41

jim lad,

the capital 21/02/2007 11:05:42

#41 thanks chum enjoy your sunshine you lucky begger.

42

,

21/02/2007 22:25:47
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 389546, Article id was mapped to record!

 

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