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HBOS rewards 100 branch managers with New York trip

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Published Date: 13 December 2008
STRICKEN bank HBOS is to fly 100 branch managers and their partners to New York to reward their performance during a year that has seen it plunge to the brink of collapse, it emerged today.
News of the lavish rewards scheme comes as staff across the company anxiously await news of anticipated widespread job cuts after the takeover of the company by Lloyds TSB got the final stamp of approval by shareholders.

The managers – from across the country and understood to include several from Edinburgh – are to have flights and accommodation for the four-day trip across the Atlantic in March fully paid for by HBOS, which will be partially owned by the taxpayer when it becomes part of the new Lloyds Banking Group.

HBOS has also confirmed that they will receive "a small amount of spending money" for the trip.

News of the trip has provoked outrage among staff and opponents of the takeover.

SNP MSP Alex Neil, a member of the Scottish Parliament's finance committee and among a group of politicians that have fought the Lloyds deal amid fears over jobs, said: "When you have up to 40,000 people who could lose their jobs it is a total insult to them that branch managers and their wives are allowed to go off on a jolly.

"This should be stopped now because it is an absurdity. The people who have allowed it should have a look at themselves in the mirror."

It is understood that the incentive scheme happens every year, with the March 2009 trip offered in November 2007 to encourage performance in the current year.

The branch managers who are chosen for the trip are those who have overseen the strongest growth above targets in their branches.

A spokeswoman for HBOS said: "Just like many companies we reward our exceptional performers. By definition, that is a small group of staff and sometimes that involves an incentive trip overseas.

"It is a reward for a very small amount of colleagues who have offered exceptional performance and gone the extra mile."

Banks have been facing closer scrutiny over their spending since the credit crunch took hold, especially Lloyds TSB, HBOS and Royal Bank of Scotland, which are each to receive Government rescue funds.

Last month, RBS cancelled its annual Group Finance Awards after it had been criticised for splashing out on lavish incentives packages.

One member of staff at HBOS said: "It is OK for them being able to get a holiday out of the company but for the rest of us we don't even know where we're going to be in 12 months."


Page 1 of 1

 
1

Stan Butler,

13/12/2008 11:20:16

Will they be visiting Wall Street?

Will they jump?

Do they have return tickets?
2

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 13/12/2008 11:38:07
I tae it they're going to NY to learn how to really screw up banks and the economy. How to sell out on your customers and go for the fast buck at the expense of the prudent.

Sometimes you have to pinch yourself to check reality - performance? Could someone please explain what performance targets they met and why it's OK to reward overall a complete failure? Insensitive and crass are almost inadequate descriptions of this beanfeast.
3

Moscow Central 42,

13/12/2008 12:04:11
Pales into insignificance when you learn that Andy Hornby, the Chief executive who has presided over this debacle, is to be employed by Lloyds TSB at a salary of £60,000 - wait for it - a month. That beggars belief.
4

disillusionedjeff,

Bristol 13/12/2008 12:12:48
I agree with moscow central - if lloyds cant manage Hbos without him they should never have offered to take them over. Any 1 man in the multi thousand employees cant be essential .
5

jumpship,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 12:14:54
Maybe the Greeks have the right idea.

Its a joke . The rich get even more stinking rich and the rest of us can go to hell.
6

Eliz,

Fife 13/12/2008 13:08:55
Time our Government stepped in to remove the cost of all "glory" outings and parties from the bail-out. Pennies to these people, but a lot of money to the rest of us. Andy Hornby should be feeling so miserable and guilty at what he has done that he should be hiding his head in shame.
7

Bang Bang Bang,

13/12/2008 13:11:31
f*ckin disgrace

8

It wasn't my fault,

13/12/2008 13:24:43
Branch Managers are relatively junior in the grand scheme of things, and have their targets driven by much higher up the chain. Did they cause the credit crunch ? Probably not. Should they be rewarded for their hard work ? Well... they wont work their backsides off for nothing, they need a dangling carrot...
9

Spout,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 13:51:18
Why doesn't the media pick on the fact the RBS, over half owned by the government, has outsourced a huge chunk of its jobs to India who in turn outsource it to China?

I find that far more scandalous than this!
10

The Squirrel,

13/12/2008 14:04:38
That's nothing - Howard's been launched into space with a lifetime's supply of pot noodles.
11

It wasn't my fault,

13/12/2008 14:05:05
They are apparently too busy calling all of the hotels in Scotland to find out if they have any bookings from any of the banks. It makes good news when they find one, didn't you know?
12

Andrew.,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 14:39:17
The journalists must be jumping up and down with joy at this news... They'll have to travel to New York to try and catch one of these guys enjoying themselves...

As it is, RBS & HBOS staff are now terrified to have a Christmas lunch in case they end up on the pages of a sordid tabloid. Sounds funny. But...

The £50-£100 of their *own* money that they might be spending that evening isn't going into the tills of hotels/bars/clubs/taxis in Edinburgh and other Scottish cities.

Multiply £100 by the 50,000 financial services staff that work across Edinburgh and you'll get a black hole that will ruin Christmas for companies and individuals that rely on the income.
13

Roo M,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 14:50:13
SNP MSP Alex Neil (said) "...it is a total insult to them that branch managers and their wives are allowed to go off on a jolly."

And their wives!

Alex Neil obviously thinks that there are no female branch managers at HBOS.
14

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 13/12/2008 14:50:52
it is simply not necessary to reward people for doing their jobs with an outing like this. They get paid for their work.
15

chico y,

13/12/2008 15:25:16
It's a sick world. Liebore and unionist posters "punching the air" at 40,000 losing their jobs.

And these greedy fat cats shaft us recession hit tax payers.

Another union dividend. Glenrothes must be proud.
16

y0y,

Nottingham 13/12/2008 15:30:06
Performance incentives are a useful way to motivate people to meet challenging targets that deliver significant benefit to a company. The problem is that businesses lose sight of the fact that it's not about local improvements - it's the bottom line for the entire business that counts. If there's no improvement there to fund local excellence then that's tough. Bonuses have to be tied to achieving overall business targets.
17

Zohan,

13/12/2008 15:38:40
end police brutality
18

Walter Ego,

Durness 13/12/2008 15:55:03
And this is the organisation which the Nats wanted to save as an independent body. Shameful. Scotland deserves better.
19

woodentop,

Behind you. 13/12/2008 16:10:29
Excellent! Another good news story for New Labour and Gordon Brown... the greedy banker theme gets another run (costing peanuts in the great scheme of things) whilst his abysmal stewardship of the economy gets a free pass. Their spin operation is much improved in recent months, I wonder why...?
20

Ianto,

Bristol 13/12/2008 16:15:58
Well.....the ink has barely dried on takeover papers and Lloyds directors demonstrate how gutless they are by not cancelling this junket.
The favoured few are being rewarded for probably doing a great job of ripping off their clients with some new financial wheeze.
Sell Lloyds shares and advise everyone you know to do the same.
It's the only way to kick pyramid selling banks and Gordon Brown in the b*l*oc*s.
21

DHS,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 16:26:47
#10 I work for HBOS and receive a salary each month for working my socks off, managers should not receive this type of bonus while other colleagues are losing their jobs. It isn't the managers who bring in the targets, it is the front facing staff. This only emphasises what is wrong with HBOS(namely halifax),spending money rashly when you don't have it. I despise Mr hornby and his incompetent board.
22

seller,

Worthing 13/12/2008 16:35:20
I will Be Closing All My Accounts With HBOS First Thing On Monday and it wont make much difference they pay one of lowest interest rates anyway
23

Scotty dog,

13/12/2008 16:38:18
I heard that it's a conference with other similar top bankers to share experiences - Lehman Bros, Citibank, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Wamu all expected to attend with a plenary presentation from Eliot Spitzer on morality
24

Jacqueline Hyde ,

On the shelf 13/12/2008 17:12:33
#10
I think you will find that, rather than working for nothing, these managers earned a basic salary plus automatic financial bonuses. However, I wouldn't worry about their little treat - if they have a morsel of conscience and integrity amongst them, they will almost certainly turn down the trip. (L.o.l.)
25

MB,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 17:29:06
So these branch managers are to be rewarded for top performance against targets in the previous year? As far as I know, much of HBOS' targets of the last few years have involved churning out as many mortgages and loans as possible. That means that these branch managers will have been the ones responsible for pushing unsustainable levels of debt and encouraging people to take out loans and mortgages they couldn't really afford. Wonderful...

If it's any consolation, the pound that they have helped to destroy with their disastrous business decisions is now so worthless, they'll find it a stretch to afford much in dollars while in New York.
26

Fecker,

13/12/2008 18:15:19
~5, you are spot on mate. The sooner we stand up and be counted the better, otherwise we will continue to be sh*t apon as always.

I also hope that these greedy bankers will declare this trip to the tax man, surely this is a taxable perk??
27

Gorach,

Gaelic heartland 13/12/2008 18:17:57
Disgraceful.
People with principle would not accept the offer.
Meeting goal targets means handing out mortgages that should not have been given due to risk and thats what got them in trouble in the first place.

My old mum is sreaming - move your accounts!
Aye, Standard Life and RBS are waiting for us with open arms. Perhaps its time to put BoS out of its misery. A new commercial bank should be created in Scotland.

Slainte!

28

Jimmy Twoshoes,

13/12/2008 18:24:19
Disgraceful? Don't be stupid.

How long ago do you think these trips were awarded? I'd guess 6 months+, and the money would be lost if they didn't go. This has already been seen with Christmas dinners and evenings out, and has cost the business millions of pounds.

Surely the better option is to have the staff receive the benefit? Are people really so spiteful to prefer money to be throw away?

The 'greedy banker' bandwagon is tiresome now, and morons that have nothing constructive to say even more so.
29

brianmca3,

auld reekie 13/12/2008 18:26:41
this has to be a sick joke?,i wonder how many ex woolies employees banked with this lot
talk about sooking up the gravy
biggest bunch of bankers going
aye and brown and darling will be joining them to get the thanks for the trip
BAH HUMBUG
30

Jimmy Twoshoes,

13/12/2008 18:28:20
33 - you typify my point. I heard a phrase once and it's stuck with me... Minimum wage mentality. Seems to fit.
31

Mpjeasteroad,

Musselburgh 13/12/2008 18:59:38
My daughter works for HBOS. Her Christmas function has been cancelled at short notice. I understand staff have been told it is not appropriate for the bank to be seen to be 'part' funding a celebration in the midst of this economic crisis!!!!!!!!!! Double standards it seems and a failure to look after the staff who actaully keep the customers on side.
32

,

13/12/2008 19:02:23
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
33

The Ayrshire Bard,

13/12/2008 19:03:05
Personally I rather envy them. I'd love to go to NY but can't afford it. I only wish that these incentive schemes had been in vogue when I was a bit younger. You went to work and were expected to do a full days work for a full days pay without the need of further bribery. However, it does seem to be an unfortunate piece of timing that is bound to upset an awful lot of people.
34

brianmca3,

auld reekie 13/12/2008 19:05:31
#36
yes bank managers are a seperate breed they all have a spiteful gene,and a gimme gimme attitude,they swan off to exotic places,and for what?,oh a conference with other greedy pigs
maybe we will see the end of these greedy sods
but then pigs fly dont they?
35

Alanski2005,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 19:48:58
Is this an example of Gordon Brown's heroic 'I saved the world' strategy? All you people who voted for the takeover are idiots.
36

AB_R,

13/12/2008 19:55:56
#11, both HBoS and Lloyds outsource work to India. As for RBS, what I have heard is that they (like a number of other employers) are bringing the work back on-shore as they have found out the hard way that the IT skills just aren't there.
37

The real dracula,

13/12/2008 20:23:41
The managers incentives should be to keep their jobs by working harder not going off for jollies at the expense of their co workers.

Have they no conscience
38

Skinnybob,

13/12/2008 20:57:37
Until the financial service industry as a whole moves away from commission based payments they will never stop banks, insurance companies, ifas, etc from selling whatever they can to customers - regardless of whether or not the product is suitable.

How many mortgages were sold to people at 5 or 6 times salary? The mortgage advisers are paid to sell mortgages - if they client defaults and can't pay it back how much commission do you think is taken back from the salesman? Probably hee-haw, so there is no dis-incetive.

Banks and insurance companies are not there to look after their customers interest. They never have been and they never will be. It's shareholder, shareholder, shareholder all the way.
39

Get off your high horse,

13/12/2008 21:00:46
Before I start, I don't work for a Bank.
I am amazed that there are so many people who demonstrate a total lack of understanding as to how the private sector works. The people who make the big decisions in the Banks are the ones who are highly paid, so get off the backs of the common workers who are just trying to earn a living. The Bankers who face so much of your wrath, are paid 9-5 but the ones who win incentives have to put in many more hours of their own time because they are motivated individuals who are good at what they do. Remove these incentives, which only a fraction of the workforce ever get to go on and the fact is that the Banks would be in significantly more trouble than they are already in, because these workers create the majority of the profits.
In terms of the 'tax payers money' points, just how far do people think this tax payers money stretches? It seems to be paying for everything going just now. How much tax do you think the Banks pay to HM Treasury every year?
The majority of these stories are thin on facts and the rest is made up to upset people further about the economy. The papers write what they think you want to read and love all your vengeful tirades, to help them sell more papers.
40

Mr Fuzzy,

Edinburgh 13/12/2008 21:40:48
Sounds more like a free job hunting party. Plenty of time to schmoozing in the chance of getting a job in the USA.
41

A. Puschkin,

13/12/2008 22:14:24

It is a sick joke!

Those "high performing managers were probably selling mortgages of 125% .... good for the Bank but one of the causes of its downfall!!!!!

but

The Bank of Scotland is/was a private business and can do what it likes - which is why we have lost the oldest Bank in Scotland.
....................see below................

"....A spokeswoman for HBOS said: "Just like many companies we reward our exceptional performers. By definition, that is a small group of staff and sometimes that involves an incentive trip overseas.

"It is a reward for a very small amount of colleagues who have offered exceptional performance and gone the extra mile...."

QED
42

voteBNP,

London 13/12/2008 22:31:10
This trip to New York sounds more like a punishment than a reward. I used to live in New York City. It's not a nice place; it's very much like a large stinking open sewer.
43

,

13/12/2008 22:33:43
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
44

Sir AIbertt x2,

13/12/2008 22:37:49
#41 HBOS outsource a very small chunk of IT services to India. This is a cheaper option than hiring full-time employees to do very basic work.

HBOS employs over 4,000 IT staff in the UK. Try and get accurate information before posting complete sh1te.
45

Jimmy Twoshoes,

13/12/2008 22:56:33
Albert, refreshing to see someone who actually knows what they are talking about (the twaddle of Mr Puschkin @ #46 typifies the nonsense idiots spout when they want a moan).

I share your sentiment at the end of #48..

46

AlasdairM,

13/12/2008 23:54:43
#3 - it really does look like a conflict of interest, Hornby running HBOS pre-takeover, attempting to get maximum shareholder value when being bought by Lloyds, however knowing fine well he'll be in a job with them once the deal is complete.

#48 - I completely agree. I feel that HBOS employees have been shafted from upon high, and there was no way the deal would not have gone through. At no point did the board entertain the notion of an alternative to the Lloyds deal, and the speed with which HBOS started sharing company-confidential information with Lloyds really implies that talks had been ongoing for a good deal longer than was said to the press.
47

Lin (From Edinburgh),

Indiana USA 14/12/2008 00:49:34
New York City?????
Sounds like punishment to me!!
48

Twaddle,

Edinburgh 14/12/2008 01:06:07
OMG - it's so good to see some sense eventually - No 44,48 and 51. BTW - what IS your point No 46?

Government conspiracy - oh YEAH. The media has somehow been gagged. Fair play to them - no government has managed it so well before. Don't know what this Government has over the media but I've never heard them so quiet in the event of such poor government performance.

Did you see the voting form for HBOS shareholders and staff? No less than 12 boxes to tick and hundreds of pages of gumph to get through. TSB shareholders at least had an easy choice. Want the government money? -TICK. Want to aquire a bank at a mega cheap rate? - TICK.

I reckon the Government has seen many of the interventions in the whole HBOS/Lloyds process as unnecessary and unwelcome distractions. I'm sure Jim Spowart had a propositon worth listening to. Likewise Burt and Mathewson. Why was the government so hell bent on ignoring the options?

Note to the media - give up on the witch hunt for all bank staff (not just HBOS) and start focusing on the real issue - the Government. OK senior (I MEAN SENIOR) Bank officials have a lot to answer for (and they need to get out of eachothers' and the government's pockets), but let's leave the ordinary guy with the ordinary job out of it. Like someone said earlier - the majority of bank staff are scared to have Christmas lunch - not much fun.
49

Twaddle,

Edinburgh 14/12/2008 01:15:56
Forgot to say. The counry might be in a mess, but has anyone considered the amount of money which has poured out of the UK to Eastern Europe as a result of the inadequate imigration laws here? Don't you reckon that might have a significant impact on our current economic position?
50

COLINTON.MAINS,

Oakville Ontario 14/12/2008 01:54:35
THEY.SHOULD.COME.TO.CANADA.AND.LEARN.HOW.TO.RUN.A.BANK
51

grego,

Rhode Island USA 14/12/2008 02:26:53
Jimmy Twoshoes

I agree with some of your postings but remember that the overall fault lies with the banking system. TO EVERYBODY WHO HAS POSTED HERE A fractional reserve debt/money fiat system where money is created by banks out of thin air cannot survive. Money should always be created by the Treasury on behalf of the people not by private banks. Want to learn??-download "Debt as Money" ( free download) and be amazed. Also "The Money Masters". Also free. Then you will know.
52

juan_r,

14/12/2008 04:19:00
#54 Twaddle...

Which Eastern European countries do you think our economy is being drained by, and which immigration laws are a problem?

The bulk of the Eastern European workers are here as fellow members of the EU, and pay their taxes just like the rest of the legal workers here. They are here because there is a demand for their work, no other reason.

If you are talking about illegal workers from non-EU countries without work permits who are not paying taxes...feel free to report them and have them removed from the Country.
53

J McAllister,

Edinburgh 14/12/2008 06:42:40
"Remove these incentives, which only a fraction of the workforce ever get to go on and the fact is that the Banks would be in significantly more trouble than they are already in, because these workers create the majority of the profits."

A totally unsubstantiated assertion. In fact, evidence suggests the contrary, that these incentives actually reduce performance for all but the simplest tasks. Plus there are a multitude of principal-agent problems, incentives to focus on the short term at the expense of the long etc. What you've said sounds prima facie like a good story. Shame it isn't actually true.
54

J McAllister,

Edinburgh 14/12/2008 06:47:03
"A fractional reserve debt/money fiat system where money is created by banks out of thin air cannot survive."

In fact, creating money "out of thin air" when someone makes a promise to do a fixed amount of future work (e.g. takes on a mortgage) makes perfect sense. It's not the problem per se. The problem is when the assessment of the plausibility of the IOU is bogus. When you lend somebody 8x their salary reasoning that even though they won't personally be able to earn that much money, inflation and house price rises should take care of things, you're building failure into the future of the system, because you are monetizing debts that cannot be paid off, only moved on to greater fools. Therefore the value you have declared to be legitimate and added to the money supply will of necessity have to be removed in part at a later date when reality bites, causing a deflationary shock.

And - hey presto - here we are.
55

letitbenick,

durham 14/12/2008 10:33:52

Some get trips to New York next year on the taxpayer.

Others look forward to having their savings took from them (CF Edinburgh)

Where's the FSA enforcement team then.

Lifes a Bitch.



56

Gorach,

Uig 14/12/2008 14:13:03
#50 Clearly a Duke of Edinburgh gold medal winner.
57

Marga,

Edinburgh 14/12/2008 17:20:17
Article from the Sunday Herald:

A parcel o’ rogues plus Mandy: How HBOS was lost
BUSINESS COMMENT: By Robert McDowell

WHEN THE Belgian bank Fortis was taken over in October, board members could not appear in public without risking violent abuse, such was the blow to national pride of the bank's collapse. Should it be different for our banks? Friday's demise of HBOS is a profound blow to Scotland's national economic pride and the political fallout will remain active for a long time yet.

Fortis shareholders are taking the Board to court for negligence in the custody of their money. I believe in both Belgium and Holland. What's wrong with the British (including the Scots)?
58

Finbarr Saunders,

14/12/2008 17:24:35
Utterly, utterly thoughtless for the managers concerned to even consider jetting off on a jolly like this in the present climate.

How do they sleep at night?
59

oxgangs london ontario,

Canada 14/12/2008 18:01:07
Spot on #55
60

Eve,

Scotland Bonnie Scotland 14/12/2008 18:17:41
HBOS are gonney get a shock come Monday morning and over the next few weeks, when people like me close their accounts. I've had my account since I was a wee girl.

Alot of custmers are really unhappy about the merger or take over (which is possibly a more acurate discription).
61

Gorach,

The west awake 14/12/2008 23:39:20
#65 Aye lassie, more power to ye and others like ye.
If ever the old independent rebellious spirit of Scotland is needed it is now. Power to the people.

62

sapper,

EDINBURGH 15/12/2008 09:56:18
If public funding was used in their bale-out then every item of extravagent spending on their junkets should attract the scrutiny of the NATIONAL AUDIT
63

For Scotlands Future,

Vote for the SNP 15/12/2008 10:38:27
#1 :>
64

Barney Google,

The Big (wormy, rotting, falling-apart) Apple 16/12/2008 17:36:44
Let'm come to NY, put their coin in the paper cups of the laid-off bankers and lawyers.

 

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